1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

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Roy Hersh
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1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

Post by Roy Hersh »

Derek and I met with Miguel Corte-Real at the beginning of the week and over the course of lunch, I finally garnered the nerve to be very direct about the issues with TCA that revolve around the 1983 Cockburn's Vintage Port.

Miguel mentioned that he had found there were early signs that this was a problem and brought them up to the powers that be within Cockburn's. He said that many bottles were opened and checked for TCA and then recorked, many dumped. However, he believes there is about a 30% incidence of TCA in the remaining bottles from what he is aware of. I did not want to be too aggressive and ask how they could let even 10% out onto the marketplace, but I did ask if there was anything that we the consumer could do with our corked bottles or cases and he sheepishly shook his head "no" and that ended that discussion.

I may have left out a point or two that Derek may remember and add to this, but that is what stuck with me.

I am not trying to embarrass Miguel or Cockburn's but this is a very significant issue and to my knowledge, it was never directly discussed before with Miguel, although I did mention it very gently during the London vertical last October. It was neither the time nor the place to pursue the topic, but over a quiet lunch this past Monday, it needed to be aired once and for all.

I wish there was a better resolution, but I don't get the idea that we'll ever be made whole for our holdings of that tainted Port. He said there was a lesser issue with TCA in 1985 Cockburn too, but from what I gathered, we're talking a fraction of the issue realized with 1983.
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Derek T.
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Re: 1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

Post by Derek T. »

I think what Miguel told us was that the TCA issue was discovered pre-shipment and Miguel and others spent many weeks re-opening every bottle, tasting a sample from each, throwing away anything detected as being tainted and then re-corked those that had no signs of taint. I was left with the distinct impression that Miguel and everyone else at Cockburn believed they had removed all of the tainted bottles and did not knowingly ship corked wine. Unfortunately, the exercise seems to have been only partly successful.
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Roy Hersh
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Re: 1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

Post by Roy Hersh »

I am in 100% agreeement that they did not ship KNOWINGLY with corked wine, but it seems (nonetheless) that they did so anyway. As mentioned many times in the past, I have often found that with this particular wine, the TCA does not show up until about 5 hours of decanting time has taken place. As we saw with the bottle in London together, it can start out at a very low level and can really get much worse over the course of the rest of the night. That is not always the case with TCA, and I have had some bottles that were absolutely awfully corked from the second I removed the cork. Who knows, all I can say is that the 30% figures is WAY below what I have noticed over the years and from what others also say on wine bulletin boards across the net.
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Chris Doty
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Re: 1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

Post by Chris Doty »

Thanks Roy and Derek for shedding some light on the 1983 Cockburn.

I actually had no idea about the wine's past when I popped it last night.

Anyway, the bottle I opened was not only not flawed, it was perfectly mature and giving ample pleasure (especially considering the vintage).

I awarded the bottle 90 points (for calibration purposes, this is the same as I have previously given to representative bottles of: 1970 Gould Campbell, 1983 Dow's, 1960 Croft, 1966 Delaforce and others within that same band of quality/complexity/verve).

Based on your story, I doubt I will seek out additional bottles, but just let it be known that not all 83 Cockburns are crap, and at least some of those that aren't are actually fantastic. I guess this actually makes the fact that so many are riddled with TCA even more frustrating. Oh well...there's always the handy Noval Black ($15.41 delivered) in case things go wrong!
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Derek T.
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Re: 1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

Post by Derek T. »

Chris,

It is definitely an added frustration that when Ck83 is untainted, it is excellent. It is a while now since that discussion over lunch in Oporto but I seem to remember Miguel telling us that whenever he wanted to show the 83 at a tasting he would take three times as many bottles as he needed to give himself a cat in hell's chance of having some that were not tainted.

I suppose if you found a stash at an absolute bargain price it still might be worth a punt on a few bottles, provided you can accept that some will go down the drain.
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Roy Hersh
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Re: 1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

Post by Roy Hersh »

Chris,

There's no denying that the rare untainted bottle of Cockburn's 1983 is about as good as any other Port of that vintage. Sadly that is rare, although I have had my share of bottles that did show beautifully. I still have 8 or 9 bottles of this Port from two cases originally. But I am now afraid to open them for any kind of tasting. I had my hands on a bottle for last Friday, was going to open it as my 7th bottle contributed to our tasting on #PortDay, but put it back on the rack with a sad grimace and just loaded up the other half dozen bottles.

I wish I could tell in advance how many of my remaining bottles were tainted. From the first case, I actually only had a few that were really bad. This second case is a real bummer. For whatever reason, it seems like the longer I've had them the worse they get and the worse my odds have been of finding a clean bottle.

I don't think I am alone. [friends.gif]
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Andy Velebil
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Re: 1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

Post by Andy Velebil »

It is sad these have such issues. The sole clean bottle I've had was amazing, all the rest were corked :( I think I have one left and as soon as I dig it out of the offsite I'll open it. No need to have a bottle take up needed space when the corked rate is almost 100%.

The interesting part is it usually takes at least 4-5 hours in a decanter for this to start showing overt signs of being corked. I guess a testament to how powerful the fruit is in this.
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Richard Henderson
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Re: 1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

Post by Richard Henderson »

I apprciate the fact that you spoke to them directly about the issue. Maybe I was too ignorant to notice but the first bottles of the 83 Cockburn I boought in the 90's did not seem to be corked. More recent purchases had more problems. I wonder if some cases/shipments had less problems.
My experience is now the same as yours. I have 6 bottles left. I am just going to open them from time to time and hope for the best.
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Re: 1983 Cockburn VP - right from the source

Post by Moses Botbol »

I have had this vintage 3-5 times and only once was it 100% TCA free and what a port it was! I like their vintage ports, but it's too bad they aren't doing anything for the consumer.
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