BENTO AMARAL - from the IVDP

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Bento Amaral
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Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:23 am
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

2- Underrated categories / 3- 10 years tasting like a 20 years
Reply to: Moses Botbol (part 2)

2-In my opinion Crusted is the most underrated category of Port wine. This almost Vintage like style is only produced by 3 or 4 producers and I think it should be better known by the consumer

3- If someone sends us a sample of a Tawny 20 years to be approved as a 10 years, it’s approved. It’s a better wine (supposing the wine has the expected quality for a Tawny 20 years). We’ve to judge only if the wine attains the minimum standards. The same for the case if someone sends a Vintage to be approved as an LBV. But none does it because it’s expensive, even if in some cases we’ve Tawny 10 y.o older than 10 years, but I think the maximum is 13-15.
Bento Amaral
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

Benchmarking Douro wines
Reply to: Paul Foutain

We’ve started to taste (end of 2003) with the previous Tasting Chamber (from Casa do Douro) in charge of the Douro wines. This was our first benchmark. As there was a transition of a certification entity we didn’t wanted more “trouble” and changing at the same time the criteria to approve a wine. One or two years later, in meetings with members of the Appeal Council Tasters (JCP- please read previous posts regarding this subject) and using wines that I’ve requested to different producers, we’ve set new standards slightly higher and with the division of quality levels for the Douro standard, Reserva and Grande Reserva (which didn’t existed before). So the new benchmarks have been done by these JCP members with me, using wines that different producers thought they have the quality for each of these levels.
Moreover we taste regularly (aprox. 12 times a year) wines from different wine regions of the world (rest of Portugal included). These sessions, with theoretical introduction and tasting have different themes; the most usual are: wine regions of the world and grape varieties.
Bento Amaral
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

What lead you to work for the IVDP and want to become a taster?
Reply to: Andy Velebil

Working at IVDP as a taster, I think this wasn’t only a question of wanting and ability but also a little bit of luck. I’ve studied food engineering at Porto. At the 5th year I went to Enology at Bordeaux. I was interested in wine but at this time I became passionate on wine and tasting. Wine was my life!
After that I had a sea accident and as a result I’m quadriplegic. So my dream to make wine in Australia “was drawn” in this accident. My first job was for Microsoft but I still kept contact with wines, going to fairs, judging at the International Wine Challenge, working at the University in wine and organizing wine tastings.
When the position for head of the tasting panel of IVDP was available, a friend told me and I got the job. It was important to be known in the wine trade and recognized (by some people) as a taster. At this time I was invited teacher at the University in charge of the wine tasting module in a post-graduation of wine marketing.
I love this job because I can taste a wide variety of styles of wine daily and help to improve the quality of Port and Douro wines.
Ronald Bock
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Ronald Bock »

Hi Bento:

I have a bottle of 1994 Fonseca Vintage Port and I am wondering what the drinking window for this vintage is. Also how long can I keep it once it is opened?

Ron Bock.
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John M.
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by John M. »

Dear Bento;

Thank you for coming here and giving freely of your time and knowledge....A Few Questions:

1. I agree that Crusted Port should be produced more. But why isn't it? Is it because Late Bottle Vintage takes up most of that market and is easier to produce?

2. What is one thing about the IVPD that people hardly ever ask about or don't know but you find interesting?

Thank you...John
Any Port in a storm!
Eric Menchen
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Eric Menchen »

Dear Mr. Amaral,

You mentioned some of the process to become a taster, and the requirements to be able to taste flaws and such. I found that I initially wasn't that sensitive to diacetyl and oxidation at very low levels, but I've managed to train myself such that I can better detect them. (And while I can detect TCA, I don't find it all that objectionable at low levels compared to most people, so I'm not usually the first person to mention it.) Even then, there are some chemicals that some people are simply insensitive to. Can one become an IVDP taster with a known insensitivity to certain flavor chemicals, e.g. acetaldehyde? If so, how do you deal with that?

Related to this but something of a tangent: While a panel will taste the wines, do they all take notes and record scores or a pass/fail individually, or is there discussion amongst the individual tasters before a final decision is made?

-Eric M.
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Roy Hersh
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Roy Hersh »

Dear Bento,

This is great and I keep having a question pop into my head during the daytime and write it down so when I am next at my computer, I won't forget to put it on here.

Is there any updated information available on the particular ratings of vineyards (A-I) and how the points (minimum to maximum) play out to become a specific letter grade? Also IIRC, there was a maximum of 1200+ points at one time, how about nowadays?

Thank you again!
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
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Eric Ifune
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Eric Ifune »

Mr. Amaral,
You've mentioned a lot of innovation in Port wine styles over the past few years. Do you lately see more examples of older, but more rarer styles such as Garriferria styled Port?
Thank you.
Christian Gollnick
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Christian Gollnick »

Dear Mr Amaral,
It’s absolutely fascinating to read your thoughts and comments.

As I understand, you are not only tasting Port and Douro Wines, but also the “Aguardentes” – which I suppose is one of the more unpleasant moments of your work day.
Aguardente has seen some drastic price increases over the last years – which is not so dramatic for the pricing of Vintage Port but has huge consequences for the pricing of entry-level Ports. From your experience, have you seen a trend for Aguardente? Do companies use now lower quality Aguardente for their entry-level Ports, to compensate for the rising prices? Or does the Aguardente-quality in general get better, which could be one of the reasons why the quality of Port Wines in general gets better (as you mentioned earlier in this guest corner)?

On another note: As you said, you taste almost 20 Ports a day. In which sequence does this happen? Young Rubies and then the old Rubies, followed by young Tawnies, then the old Tawnies? And the Aguardente afterwards? Or do you have a Tawny Day with only Tawnies, followed by a Ruby Day with only Rubies?

Please keep up the great work, Mr Amaral. Please protect the quality of the Port Wine as good as you can, and we promise that we will drink as much of it as we can... [cheers.gif]
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David Spriggs
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by David Spriggs »

Dear Bento,
First, I just want to say how much I've enjoyed reading through all the questions and your fantastic and detailed responses. Bravo!

Now my question. I know that the IVDP is involved with making sure that there is no adulteration of the wines. I assume that is for both Port and Douro wines. How does the IVDP make sure that no grapes come across the border from Spain? For example (and this is a tough one), how can the IVDP tell the difference between a wine made from a 100% Douro grown Tinta Roriz and one adulterated with Spanish Tempranillo?
Thank you!
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Derek T.
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Derek T. »

Bento,

There is an ongoing discussion on this forum that you might be able to help us with. The discussion can be found here: http://www.fortheloveofport.com/ftlopfo ... 2&start=20

In summary, the question is...

Is it possible for Douro producers to create and sell either dry or fortified wines made from grapes grown from within the region but to avoid the regulations set down by the IVDP and Potuguese legislation by not calling the wines "Port" or "Douro DOC"?

If there is specific legislation or IVDP rules that answer this question could you please point us to them?

Thank you.

Derek
Bento Amaral
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Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:23 am
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

Very old wood aged Tawny Ports
Reply to: Roy Hersh

I think that you’re talking about Scion, Tributa (Vallado), Niepoort VV and so on. These wines have been approved by IVDP as very old Tawny Ports (more than 40 years old, even if this mention can be also used for 30 years old Ports). For the tasting panel is a nice surprise when we’re tasting and there’s one of these wines! You can notice that none of these wines have a mention of a date on the label (which is also controlled by IVDP).
On another hand are the Colheitas like Andresen 1900 and 1910 and also Wiese & Krohn 1863 which need to have the paperwork but also an approval of the date in the tasting. Of course evaluating the exact date of a wine with more than one century only by tasting is extremely difficult.
Bento Amaral
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Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:23 am
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

New Port wine categories: white port with indication of age and Pink Port
Reply to: Roy Hersh (on behalf of Frederick Blais) and Moses Botbol

From my post “New Port wine categories: white port with indication of age” (Oct 27 8:01 am)
Old white ports exists for a longtime in the companies, even if this new category only exists since 2007 (?).So there was no need to have a Committee to decide beforehand: winemakers and IVDP tasters knew previously what the expected characteristics for these wines were.
On another hand, before having the Pink Port there were some exchanges between the Producer who wanted to do it and IVDP.
Sometimes the JCP (please see answer above) tastes several samples of a type of Port to check if they achieve the standard for it
.”

Regarding the Pink Port, in the beginning there was a need to make some adjustments (issues related to alcohol intensity and fruit).
After the creation of the new category: the main reasons for rejections of Pink Port are: bad evolution, clumsy balance in mouth (some tannins), bad brandy integration, lack of intensity and purity of fruit.
Bento Amaral
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Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:23 am
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

Evolution of the Douro wines quality. Best Douro and Port wines
Reply to: Miguel Simoes

I think there’s a noticeable increase of quality of the Douro wines. Better balanced tannins, less overripe fruit and a better usage of wood.

Due to my professional position I can’t give you advices of the better Douro or Port wines. The Port wines that I’ve mentioned in a previous post are wines that re inaccessible (or almost) and also a type of wine (very old Tawny).
Bento Amaral
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Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:23 am
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

Food and drinks to avoid before tasting
Reply to Glenn Elliot


I try to avoid intense food like garlic, onion and curry on the meal before tasting as well as drinking wine. Usually I try to drink water.
I don’t smoke neither drink coffee, but some tasters do. So there is an interdiction to do it 30 mins prior to tasting.
Usually I feel a metallic taste on the first wine of the afternoon. I think it’s a reaction with the remains of umami of lunch food. To not penalize the wine, I retaste it later.
Bento Amaral
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Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

1994 Fonseca Vintage Port
Reply to Ronald Bock


Generally I think, after the first 4 years after the harvest, when you can drink powerful Vintage, the wines enter in a “teenage” phase between its 5th - 6th and 15th /20th anniversary. This is the period where I think they’re not so good. They’ve lost the intensity and power of a young wine but they didn’t gain yet the delicacy and balance of an aged Vintage Port. Some Vintages tend to stay in this stage for a longer period. I think it depends on the Vintage and on the Producer. Probably I would keep this bottle at least more 4 or 5 years, but if you want to drink only near 2035, I expect that it’ll be great! I hope not making you wait too long!
I recommend to drink a Vintage between the first and the third day after the bottle has been opened. After that the oxidation will be more and more noticeable, even if in a gradual way.
Bento Amaral
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Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:23 am
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

Crusted and IVDP accreditation (1st in the world)
Reply to John

1- I think there are 2 main reasons for Crusted being less known, the first is, in my opinion, a good value for the money, and producers are less interested in producing it. The second, and probably the most important one, is, as the category is less known, there isn’t a consumer demand and the companies don’t do it.
2- IVDP tasting panel was the first to get a quality accreditation in the world in 1999. For this, we’ve to follow an ISO norm. Our tasting conditions are controlled and we taste in a special room, not like the beautiful tasting rooms in the warehouses with a view to the Douro River. 10% of the samples are repetitions to test the tasters. If they don’t give reproducible results, they’re excluded of the jury.
Bento Amaral
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Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:23 am
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

Tasting panel decisions and specific anosmia
Reply to: Eric Menchen


None of the tasters of IVDP tasting panel has specific anosmia (incapability to smell a specific aroma) for the most important faults (acetaldehyde, acetic acid, ethyl acetate, volatile phenols, sulphur compounds, moulds (TCA, TBA,…) and others). We make regularly tests of identification in wine and in solutions. To test the sensivity of the tasters we participate in interlaboratorial tests, where tasters from different institutions and companies smell the same aroma at the same concentrations. These tests have been developed in IVDP and are being conducted by ALABE (Enology Laboratory Association). You can check some results here http://www.alabe.pt/pt/sensorial/relatorios_sa.php . I’m sorry but I can’t give the IVDP key but assure that we’ve good results. :-)

The tasting panel decisions is the result of individual decisions without discussion. But after the end of the session (much more with Douro wines), we discuss our decisions. It’s a way to assess and compare the results
Bento Amaral
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Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:23 am
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Bento Amaral »

Hi to all,
I’ll answer everyone’s questions. Most of the cases by chronological order. At this moment I’m answering yesterday’s PM
Moses Botbol
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Re: BENTO AMARAL

Post by Moses Botbol »

Bento:

Can you provide us with some samples of tasting notes that you would typically write about a wine? Perhaps one from a new Vintage-Ruby-LBV and aged tawny?
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