I was shopping for a really nice vintage port, like Taylor Fladgate 2011 vintage. The sales person in the large liquor store( Colorado laws ) assured me that it is much too soon to drink a 2011 vintage port?
What are your thoughts on this?
2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Moderators: Glenn E., Roy Hersh, Andy Velebil
-
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2014 11:24 am
- Location: Broomfield, CO, USA
-
- Posts: 6335
- Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:48 pm
- Location: Longmont, Colorado, United States of America - USA
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Some people like them young. If you're one of those people, give it a try. I've had some of the Taylor 2011 from a 375, and as I recall I liked it, but nowhere near as much as a 1970 That sales person was giving you conventional wisdom. If you wish to defy this wisdom, there might be better/cheaper options than Taylor. The Total Beverage on Sheridan has been my favorite Colorado source. I bought 2011 Taylor from two different out of state sources.
Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
-
- Posts: 5935
- Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 7:38 am
- Location: Boston, USA
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
I wouldn't drink it now unless you want to know what young port tastes like. Expensive lesson, but then you'll know. I would stick to 10-20-30 year tawny if you're looking to pick something up at liquor store for immediate consumption.
Welsh Corgis | F1 |British Cars
- Eric Ifune
- Posts: 3407
- Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:02 pm
- Location: Las Vegas, Nevada, United States of America - USA
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Depends what you're looking for. If the experience of mature Port, then certainly not. But if you wish to experience youthful exuberence and primary fruit then yes. I agree with Eric M. in that if looking for the second, then there are cheaper alternatives. I think the true quality of Taylors comes out with age.
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
I've had a couple of Vintage 2011s (Niepoort, Sandeman Vau).
I knew they were "too young to drink".
But they were also quite amazing - immensely enjoyable (after some time in the decanter).
I've also had some old vintage - also quite amazing, but in a very different way.
I can buy a Graham's 1985 for the same price as 4 of the 2011 Sandeman Vau (I live in Portugal). It's a tough call. But in my "cellar" I have 17 of the Vau and none of the 1985.
I'm not, personally, a fan of tawny port - I like my port to taste like fortified wine, and old tawny simply doesn't.
I'd humbly suggest that the only way to find out what you like, and don't like, is to sample things - have an old tawny, have a young 2011, try a white, a Colheita, get an old Vintage. If you can find a cheaper 2011 (I'm guessing the Taylor isn't cheap) that will make it a less expensive, but probably equally valid, test.
I knew they were "too young to drink".
But they were also quite amazing - immensely enjoyable (after some time in the decanter).
I've also had some old vintage - also quite amazing, but in a very different way.
I can buy a Graham's 1985 for the same price as 4 of the 2011 Sandeman Vau (I live in Portugal). It's a tough call. But in my "cellar" I have 17 of the Vau and none of the 1985.
I'm not, personally, a fan of tawny port - I like my port to taste like fortified wine, and old tawny simply doesn't.
I'd humbly suggest that the only way to find out what you like, and don't like, is to sample things - have an old tawny, have a young 2011, try a white, a Colheita, get an old Vintage. If you can find a cheaper 2011 (I'm guessing the Taylor isn't cheap) that will make it a less expensive, but probably equally valid, test.
- Andy Velebil
- Posts: 16626
- Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 4:49 pm
- Location: Los Angeles, California, United States of America - USA
- Contact:
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Absolutely agree. Try everything you can as that is the best way to determine what you like and don't like. And the best way to learn about wines from any region you focus on. Often times, for newer stuff anyways, you can get .375ml bottles which are cheaper and will more easily allow you to try a variety of things quicker. I'd also recommend attending any tasting you can find in your area. Though this can be a little problematic with younger VP, as often they are not decanted ahead of time and don't always show their best (a long standing gripe many of us here have).Roger L. wrote: I'd humbly suggest that the only way to find out what you like, and don't like, is to sample things - have an old tawny, have a young 2011, try a white, a Colheita, get an old Vintage. If you can find a cheaper 2011 (I'm guessing the Taylor isn't cheap) that will make it a less expensive, but probably equally valid, test.
Andy Velebil Good wine is a good familiar creature if it be well used. William Shakespeare http://www.fortheloveofport.com
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
I don't think the benefits of decanting are stressed enough.Andy Velebil wrote:Roger L. wrote: ...a little problematic with younger VP, as often they are not decanted ahead of time and don't always show their best (a long standing gripe many of us here have).
I drink a lot of wine, and I always decant for at least an hour (unless it's fizzy, of course) - but I always try a splash immediately after decanting - in my experience, very rarely does a wine get worse, very often it gets better. I have less experience with port, but the experience I have is that many (non-tawny) ports taste "the same", almost generic, when you pop the cork, some not even very nice - 4 or 5 hours in and you're starting to get the "real" taste. Even after that the taste may well change for another 48 hours.
The 1/2 bottle idea is an excellent one I hadn't considered.
-
- Posts: 5935
- Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 7:38 am
- Location: Boston, USA
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Why is that "of course". You don't decant Champagne? I do quite often into a cold decanter, very carefully. Even fizzy wine needs some time to open up.Roger L. wrote: I don't think the benefits of decanting are stressed enough.
I drink a lot of wine, and I always decant for at least an hour (unless it's fizzy, of course)
Welsh Corgis | F1 |British Cars
- Tom Archer
- Posts: 2789
- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 8:09 pm
- Location: Near Saffron Walden, England
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
No. This is a vintage for the medium to long haul - think 2050-2060 for peak drinking.Is the 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
However, if you have a penchant for young VP, look for something cheaper and more approachable - a single quinta VP from 2010 or 2012 perhaps..
- Andy Velebil
- Posts: 16626
- Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 4:49 pm
- Location: Los Angeles, California, United States of America - USA
- Contact:
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Tom,Tom Archer wrote:No. This is a vintage for the medium to long haul - think 2050-2060 for peak drinking.Is the 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
However, if you have a penchant for young VP, look for something cheaper and more approachable - a single quinta VP from 2010 or 2012 perhaps..
Don't you think that decision is really dependent on the person? If they're looking for a really well made, top of the heap, young VP, then right now the 2011 VP's are open for business. If they're looking to save the top of the heap VP's for when it's mature then I agree to look for something from a non-classically declared year, such as 2005 or 2010/2012.
There is nothing wrong with drinking young VP, it's really to each their own (which is most likely different than some here). I think the issue will be at some point the 2011's will most likely shut down and not be drinking well. The problem with that is, we're not really sure then that will be right now. Other than an educated guess based on older VP making techniques. But right now they are still open and drinking well....for now.
Andy Velebil Good wine is a good familiar creature if it be well used. William Shakespeare http://www.fortheloveofport.com
-
- Posts: 168
- Joined: Wed Sep 18, 2013 12:07 pm
- Location: Near Castelo Branco, Portugal
- Contact:
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Roger, I go along with you on these posts, except I only decant VPs. Everything else is left in its bottle. I am about to eat (roast beef for the main course) and I have two bottles open a Fonte de Loba Reserva 2010 (Douro - open since Friday and only one glass left) and a Piornos Reserva 2011 (Covilhã - bought yesterday and opened last night with only a half glass tasted). I have quite a few Piornos 2010s in the cellar and I wanted to see whether the 2011 is as good. I will make it last another couple of nights. I also have a 5L cask of Pedras Negras to check "value for money". I always have a cask of red and white on the go, and decide on bottles to cellar based on their relative enjoyment compared to the cask wine.Roger L. wrote: I'm not, personally, a fan of tawny port - I like my port to taste like fortified wine, and old tawny simply doesn't.Roger L. wrote: I drink a lot of wine, and I always decant for at least an hour (unless it's fizzy, of course) - but I always try a splash immediately after decanting - in my experience, very rarely does a wine get worse, very often it gets better. I have less experience with port, but the experience I have is that many (non-tawny) ports taste "the same", almost generic, when you pop the cork, some not even very nice - 4 or 5 hours in and you're starting to get the "real" taste. Even after that the taste may well change for another 48 hours.
I do not decant Champagne. In fact I never heard of anyone doing it before reading this thread. Why lose the full effect of the wine, which is bound to happen if it is decanted?
- Tom Archer
- Posts: 2789
- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 8:09 pm
- Location: Near Saffron Walden, England
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Of course - there's nought as queer as folk..Don't you think that decision is really dependent on the person?
But in general, soft vintages make better players for those who like to drink their VP young, and they are usually cheaper.
2005? - every encounter I've had with that vintage has been as hard as nails - come back in 2100 territory...look for something from a non-classically declared year, such as 2005 or 2010/2012
- Andy Velebil
- Posts: 16626
- Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 4:49 pm
- Location: Los Angeles, California, United States of America - USA
- Contact:
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Hah! But it is a non-classic year. Maybe it shouldn't have been?Tom Archer wrote:
2005? - every encounter I've had with that vintage has been as hard as nails - come back in 2100 territory...
Andy Velebil Good wine is a good familiar creature if it be well used. William Shakespeare http://www.fortheloveofport.com
- Glenn E.
- Posts: 8172
- Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:49 am
- Location: Sammamish, Washington, United States of America - USA
- Contact:
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
+1Andy Velebil wrote:There is nothing wrong with drinking young VP, it's really to each their own (which is most likely different than some here). I think the issue will be at some point the 2011's will most likely shut down and not be drinking well. The problem with that is, we're not really sure then that will be right now. Other than an educated guess based on older VP making techniques. But right now they are still open and drinking well....for now.
Right now, at least for me, all 2011 VPs are drinking very well. They're simply delicious. I expect that to remain true for at least a couple more years, but as Andy said at some point they're going to start shutting down and at that point should probably be left alone until the butterfly emerges.
If my experience with the 2003s and 2007s is any indication, the 2011s will probably start to shut down in 2017-2018.
Glenn Elliott
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Try to do these.
From 2011 i have taylor's ( not Vinhas Velhas), fonseca, niepoort, noval ( not nacional ), real companhia velha and Dow's.
I have bought 0,75cl and half bottles also.
Before open a 0,75cl i open an Half bottle to "tested".
All the best
Rui Brás
From 2011 i have taylor's ( not Vinhas Velhas), fonseca, niepoort, noval ( not nacional ), real companhia velha and Dow's.
I have bought 0,75cl and half bottles also.
Before open a 0,75cl i open an Half bottle to "tested".
All the best
Rui Brás
- Andy Velebil
- Posts: 16626
- Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 4:49 pm
- Location: Los Angeles, California, United States of America - USA
- Contact:
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
One of the few reasons why I like half bottles.R bras wrote:Try to do these.
From 2011 i have taylor's ( not Vinhas Velhas), fonseca, niepoort, noval ( not nacional ), real companhia velha and Dow's.
I have bought 0,75cl and half bottles also.
Before open a 0,75cl i open an Half bottle to "tested".
All the best
Rui Brás
Andy Velebil Good wine is a good familiar creature if it be well used. William Shakespeare http://www.fortheloveofport.com
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Me to AndyAndy Velebil wrote:One of the few reasons why I like half bottles.R bras wrote:Try to do these.
From 2011 i have taylor's ( not Vinhas Velhas), fonseca, niepoort, noval ( not nacional ), real companhia velha and Dow's.
I have bought 0,75cl and half bottles also.
Before open a 0,75cl i open an Half bottle to "tested".
All the best
Rui Brás
Re: 2011 vintage ready to drink now?
Some of the 2011 VPs were absolutely fabulous to drink on release, full of youthful and exuberant sweet fruit but with plenty of tannin and acidity. I'm still drinking some of them, but many have changed a lot in the 12 months since being bottled and most are less enjoyable. My choice for drinking right now would be Croft, Dalva (or Presedential), Dow, Ferreira, Noval, Offley, Pintas and Vesuvio. But if someone offered me a glass of any of the other 2011s, I would accept instantly. They are still really nice to drink at the moment - and will still be very enjoyable but will be very different in 20-50 years time.