Establishing my port collection.

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Svein CE
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Svein CE »

Cálem Vintage Port 1985 NOK. 499,90 75 Cl at Vinmonopolet in Norway.
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Mike Meehan
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Mike Meehan »

Calem, Churchill or Offley '85 if you can find them!
Eric Menchen
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Eric Menchen »

Of the ones you mentioned, I'd get the 1985 Ferreira. A lot of people think they shine in lesser years, but I think it would be worth a try, and to see the difference in style.
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Thomas V
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Thomas V »

Svein CE wrote:Cálem Vintage Port 1985
Thank you for your suggestion. I will take it under consideration. Have you tried it recently?
Mike Meehan wrote:Calem, Churchill or Offley '85 if you can find them!
That is 2 votes for Cálem. A house I don't really connect with VPs, interesting.
Eric Menchen wrote:Of the ones you mentioned, I'd get the 1985 Ferreira. A lot of people think they shine in lesser years, but I think it would be worth a try, and to see the difference in style.
I have had the Ferreira 85' before. It was in the spring and I must say that both the appearance and the taste of it surprised me quite a lot. It is very light for its age but is very delicious albeit a bit tawny like at this stage.
Svein CE
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Svein CE »

Thomas V wrote:
Svein CE wrote:Cálem Vintage Port 1985
Thank you for your suggestion. I will take it under consideration. Have you tried it recently?

I drank it at Christmas 2015 and liked it. I then gave a bottle to a friend, who drank it christmas 2016, and thought it to be very pleasant also.
It is one of the most mature vintage ports to be got in Norway, and I think it got some unfavourable writeups earlier, and I liked it.
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John M.
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by John M. »

Thomas V wrote:
Glenn E. wrote:Can you find a 1980 Dow?
Not at 70 USD I think.

Also that would make 2 ports from Dow's as the 1985 is already in the lineup.

The only reason there is 2 Graham's is that I got them cheap and a member really wanted to taste the 85 up against the 83 and I indulged him. The Gould Campbells also were very cheap so I decided to include both the 80 and the 85 to clear up which is the better.
1985 Quinta do Crasto....I got for $50 and was surprisingly good.
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Moses Botbol »

Eric Menchen wrote:Of the ones you mentioned, I'd get the 1985 Ferreira. A lot of people think they shine in lesser years, but I think it would be worth a try, and to see the difference in style.
I too really like '85 Ferreira, but it just recently over the last few years turned into something special. It was just "good" a decade ago, now it's another story.
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Thomas V
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Thomas V »

Heh I just can't seem to decide about the final bottle. All good suggestions but for some reason I am drawn towards the Wiese & Krohn because I haven't yet tasted one of their vintages. I will keep you updated.

Meanwhile I was part of planning and hosting a WineMakers Dinner with DR e.g. Agri Roncão this past Friday at a very hip restaurant called Domestic in Aarhus city centre. The Danish importer had kindly enough arranged for Elisabete Almeida to come to Aarhus (Her first time) after I had been pleading my case for a couple of months. I first met Elisabete at DR this September while I was visiting the Douro and she is quite the hostess. So I was happy to host her for a couple of hours in my house with my girlfriend and a few friends before we went to the restaurant and joined the remaining 50 guests.


The ports were

DR White Port
Quinta de Linhares Avesso 2013 White Wine from Vinho Verde
DR 2011 LBV
DR 10 Year Old Tawny Port
DR 2005 Colheita Port (World Premier, see if you can spot it in the picture below [yahoo.gif] )
DR 20 Year Old Tawny Port
DR 30 Year Old Tawny Port
DR 40 Year Old Tawny Port

The menu was:

Snacks accompanied by the White Port
Pan fried cod with culliflower and a sauce based on buttermilk accompanied by the White wine
Beef 2 ways, strip loin and slow braised with red beets and a potato confied' in ducks fat accompanied by the LBV Port
Baked apple, a ice cream based on crème fraiche, meringue and with sprinkled sea buckthorn on top accompanied by the 20 Year Old Tawny Port.


DR as most know, is known for their TWAIOA and have been able to produce this from the start since they took over the old pipas as part of the purchase of the estate in 2001. They then had to completely redo the fields including replanting a lot of vines to bring the Quinta up to standard which took the better part of 4 years before they were able to complete their first harvest in 2005.

That 2005 year bears a special meaning to the people at DR and that is why they have decided to produce at 2005 colheita from that year. The first ever from DR. Before the Winemakers Dinner only 3 people had tasted this colheita that is still in the casks in Roncão. The winemaker, Elisabete and Torben the Danish import. It was quite the privilege for me to be the 4th to try this young colheita. It is still very much a youngster with an excellent bouquet and a voluptuous body. It has quite its own style while still trying to shred its ruby past and move into the oxidated realm. Still in this fun domain it has good structure and acidity and I will be sure to try it again later to see how it progresses. Solid effort. People went nuts over the bottle which had no label and was completely unfiltered. That was quite the hit.

Also I will continue to hit the jungle drums and state that DR's 2011 LBV is very much worthy of recognition and your attention. I suggest you try this wine as it has shown me very good qualities both times I have tasted it. DR is not a one race pony.

My 2 favourites from the night were the 2011 LBV and the 30YO.

A final note, quite a lot of people also bought 3+ bottles of their White port and I made sure to suggest to Elisabete that they should get into the aged White port business that at least in Denmark is booming.

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Thomas V
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Thomas V »

Since I last posted in this thread I have been lucky enough to be able to add

4 x Fonseca 1985 VP
2 x Fonseca 2003 VP
2 x Dow's 1997 VP

And I just today found a European online shop that had just 2 bottles of Fonseca 1985 VP at 65 USD each and I just couldn't help myself. So I snagged those 2 as well.

2 x Fonseca 1985.

Thursday night this week in my club we are having an eighties themed VP tasting, where we will taste the following.

1980 Gould Campbell
1983 Graham's
1983 Ramos Pinto
1985 Gould Campbell
1985 Graham's
1985 Taylor's
1985 Dow's
1985 Smith Woodhouse
1987 Niepoort

I have tasted them all before except the 87' Niepoort but I really look forward to this tasting to see where the different bottles are at. The RP83 (94) and G83(92) I have had within the last 3 months and they were both really good while the RP being on another level for me. I wonder if this is still the same case? The RP83 is from the same batch where the G83 is from another.

The GC80(90), G85(91) and SWC85(91) I haven't tasted for around 1½ year and it would be good to see where they are at since I have 4+ of each of them in my cellar. From reading Rune EG's notes on the GC's I would suspect that the GC80 needs to be drunk sooner rather than later while the GC85 will keep going for 10+ years.

It is redemption time for the G85 as last time I tasted it it was a badly oxidized bottle that left much to be desired. I really hope it will be a prime showing.

The Dow's(92) is interesting to see if is in the same state as last year or if it has improved. Where as the Taylor's(90) I do not recall very vividly. Roy gave it some harsh words on FB. but Peter Skov a Danish supplier think it is slumbering and will over time be one of the great from this decade.

The Niepoort(?) is a total wildcard for me. I have sold off a few of them and kept a few, where this is one of these bottles. Will be good to finally make its acquaintance

I will be back with my thoughts and impression during the weekend.

__________________________

On a different note.

As my co-founding partner of our Aarhus Port Wine Club is abroad in the US for 1½ year. We have decided to make a Fonseca vertical tasting for his arrival back in Denmark in the spring of 2018.

As of now we have gathered the bottles marked with a * . We are currently contemplating if we should stop at both ends with the 1980 - 2007 or if we should include 09, 11, 77 and 70.

Especially the 77 and 70 will add substantially to the price per person and we are wondering if it worth it? The 2011 and 2009 are so young. What are your thoughts?

What do you think about adding in the 91 and 95 Guimaraens into the tasting?

Fonseca Vintage Ports

1970
1977
*1980
*1983
*1985
1991 Guimaraens
*1992
*1994
1995 Guimaraens
*1997
*2000
*2003
2007
2009
2011

Cheers
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Glenn E.
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Glenn E. »

Thomas V wrote:As my co-founding partner of our Aarhus Port Wine Club is abroad in the US for 1½ year. We have decided to make a Fonseca vertical tasting for his arrival back in Denmark in the spring of 2018.
Personally, I'd extend back to 1970 if you can find them for a reasonable price, but not extend forward to 2009 and 2011. Even the 2007 will likely still be too young in 2018, and those very young Ports are difficult to enjoy especially in a vertical setting. At least for me. I just find that they overpower everything else and make it so that you can't go back and re-taste the older Ports once you've proceeded through the lineup.

To be clear, I love very young Vintage Port. It's so juicy and rambunctious and in-your-face with its fruit. I just don't usually enjoy drinking it in a lineup with older Ports because it's so juicy and rambunctious and in-your-face.

I have a Graham vertical that I've been curating, and when I finally get around to drinking it I'll probably split it into two session. One for the older Ports (currently 1945-1985) and one for the youngsters (currently 1991-2011). 1985 is a bit of a problem, because while it's 30 years old it's still very young. Ideally I'd do 3 sessions, and split off 1980-1994 into a middle group.
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Thomas V
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Thomas V »

Glenn E. wrote:
Thomas V wrote:As my co-founding partner of our Aarhus Port Wine Club is abroad in the US for 1½ year. We have decided to make a Fonseca vertical tasting for his arrival back in Denmark in the spring of 2018.
Personally, I'd extend back to 1970 if you can find them for a reasonable price, but not extend forward to 2009 and 2011. Even the 2007 will likely still be too young in 2018, and those very young Ports are difficult to enjoy especially in a vertical setting. At least for me. I just find that they overpower everything else and make it so that you can't go back and re-taste the older Ports once you've proceeded through the lineup.

To be clear, I love very young Vintage Port. It's so juicy and rambunctious and in-your-face with its fruit. I just don't usually enjoy drinking it in a lineup with older Ports because it's so juicy and rambunctious and in-your-face.
Hi Glenn,

Quick response, thanks for that.

Pretty lucky that we haven't yet added the 07', 09' and 11' then. I do agree with you that tasting a 11' and then going back to something far older confuses the palate quite a bit.

I have found a bottle of Fonseca 1977 for 195 USD, seems like a pretty decent price?

What do you think about the adding the Guimaraens to the mix?
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Glenn E.
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Glenn E. »

Thomas V wrote:I have found a bottle of Fonseca 1977 for 195 USD, seems like a pretty decent price?

What do you think about the adding the Guimaraens to the mix?
$195 feels high to me, but winesearcher.com (Pro version) says it isn't that bad. You can get it for less from the UK if you don't mind having it shipped. I don't know what shipping costs are like intra-EU, but I know that UK -> US can be $50/bottle so you'd have to take that into account.

I'd only add Guimaraens if you feel you need more Port for your tasting. You're at 10 bottles 1970-2003, which seems like a nice tasting to me. But if you'll have a larger group you might want more.
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Eric Menchen
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Eric Menchen »

Spring 2018? I still have some 1970 Fonseca in the cellar. Sorry, I don't have a 1977.
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Thomas V
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Thomas V »

Glenn E. wrote:
Thomas V wrote:I have found a bottle of Fonseca 1977 for 195 USD, seems like a pretty decent price?

What do you think about the adding the Guimaraens to the mix?
$195 feels high to me, but winesearcher.com (Pro version) says it isn't that bad. You can get it for less from the UK if you don't mind having it shipped. I don't know what shipping costs are like intra-EU, but I know that UK -> US can be $50/bottle so you'd have to take that into account.

I'd only add Guimaraens if you feel you need more Port for your tasting. You're at 10 bottles 1970-2003, which seems like a nice tasting to me. But if you'll have a larger group you might want more.
I think we will add the Guimaraens for fun to see how they do against the big boys. Normally our tastings in the club are 15 people where we do a 4 cl pour per person. I think we will keep that same number for this vertical.

Regarding the 1970 and 1977 I will keep my eyes out for a good bargain as we have a year to source these 2 wines and make sure they come from good provenance. I'd rather pay more to get good bottles than ones of dubious character.

Thanks for your thoughts and input as always Glenn.
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Thomas V
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Thomas V »

Eric Menchen wrote:Spring 2018? I still have some 1970 Fonseca in the cellar. Sorry, I don't have a 1977.
Yes Martin will not be back in Denmark until April 2018. So the tasting will be late April that year.

Are you offering to sell a 1970? [friends.gif]
Eric Menchen
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Eric Menchen »

Thomas V wrote:Are you offering to sell a 1970? [friends.gif]
I'm offering to bring it. [cheers.gif]
(But it is probably a little too early to commit for sure at this point.)
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Glenn E.
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Glenn E. »

Eric Menchen wrote:
Thomas V wrote:Are you offering to sell a 1970? [friends.gif]
I'm offering to bring it. [cheers.gif]
(But it is probably a little too early to commit for sure at this point.)
If I wasn't already planning an EU trip for the 2018 Port Harvest Tour, I'd offer to bring a 1977 Fonseca. But I doubt I can manage two major trips like that in one year!
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Thomas V
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Thomas V »

Eric Menchen wrote:
Thomas V wrote:Are you offering to sell a 1970? [friends.gif]
I'm offering to bring it. [cheers.gif]
(But it is probably a little too early to commit for sure at this point.)
That would be pretty sick ( in a good way ) [d_training.gif]

Let me know what you decide when we get closer to 2018.
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Thomas V
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Thomas V »

Glenn E. wrote:
Eric Menchen wrote:
Thomas V wrote:Are you offering to sell a 1970? [friends.gif]
I'm offering to bring it. [cheers.gif]
(But it is probably a little too early to commit for sure at this point.)
If I wasn't already planning an EU trip for the 2018 Port Harvest Tour, I'd offer to bring a 1977 Fonseca. But I doubt I can manage two major trips like that in one year!
Lisbon is great in the spring time, I presume that Porto is as well.

Have you been to other cities in Europe in the spring time. Both Berlin, Amsterdam and Paris is wonderful at that time a year. Of course so is Copenhagen and Aarhus (My city).

I would happy to take a day off to show you around and arrange for perhaps an additional tasting as well as some culinary delights. We actually have 4 Michelin star restaurants, as well as some pretty exciting sights to see. There is a lot of hype surrounding our city at the moment among other things because we are the European Culture Capital of 2017.

You can read more here in English!! After which you will probably both book your tickets [friends.gif]

https://www.forbes.com/pictures/hdlf45k ... 6f44ab980e
http://www.travelandleisure.com/culture ... eling-tips
https://www.theguardian.com/travel/2016 ... lture-2017
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/201 ... arhus&_r=3
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Thomas V
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Re: Establishing my port collection.

Post by Thomas V »

Yesterday was my birthday. No Aprils fool I promise.

So I did something that I have not actively pursued previously in my purchasing of port wine. I tried to find something from my birth year 1981. Not a good year to be born in port wise I know.

So far with help from others inhere and elsewhere I had this list of 1981 port wines.

1981 Quinta do Infantado VP
1981 Ferreira VP

1981 Kopke Sao Luiz SQVP

1981 Calém LBV
1981 Ferreira LBV
1981 Niepoort LBV
1981 Warre's LBV

1981 Burmester Colheita
1981 Kopke Colheita
1981 Souza Colheita


I actually found the Calém LBV which I decanted 3 hours prior to dinner and served for my father, step mom and girlfriend afterwards. It was murky orange and had completely lost its original red appearance. No spirit or bottle stench on the nose just a faint sweet aroma of apricot marmalade. This continued into the palate where the experience was that of sweetness and a dense viscosity. Alas in my mind this LBV has been quite dead for a while. No acid lingering here nor secondary flavours. There was not much of an after-taste and this was syrupy solution that did not have much to offer. I drank my 1 glass smiled to my guests and then proceeded to get my backup bottle. My expectations where not high prior to tasting it and perhaps that was a good thing. I think next time I attempt something from 1981 I will go for the Kopke colheita. Probably a safer option... Not rated

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