A woman wrote to me requesting authentication of an old Port bottle:
... and thought maybe you can shed some light on a bottle of port that my father has--- an 1896 vintage bottle of Brooks Empress port. When I visited him recently I found this unopened bottle and wondered about its value and its drinkability. I was also curious about its history. My father has no idea when or where he got it. He is 92. The only web link I can find about it is the following:
http://bestof.clevescene.com/bestof/awa ... &year=2005
I would appreciate anything you could tell me.
Brooks Empress Port (vintage 1896)
Richard Brooks & Co., London, England
Bottled at Oporto
Printed in Portugal
Imported by Kraus Bros. & Co., New York
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Help me unlock the secret to this Port mystery
Moderators: Glenn E., Roy Hersh, Andy Velebil
Help me unlock the secret to this Port mystery
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
- Andy Velebil
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Got me, although when I was doing some Google searching I did find out this event took place in 1896...
The first modern Olympiad opens at Athens March 24 with 484 contestants from 13 nations to begin a quadrennial event that will be broadened to include athletic events undreamed of by the Greeks of ancient times.
Andy Velebil Good wine is a good familiar creature if it be well used. William Shakespeare http://www.fortheloveofport.com
- Tom Archer
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- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 8:09 pm
- Location: Near Saffron Walden, England
$8,000 is certainly a staggering price.
A sound bottle might auction in London for £200-250, and retail for £350-400.
Allowing for the uplift on US prices, a US retail price should be around $1000-1200.
Although 1896 was a widely declared year, there is no guarantee that this is in fact a vintage port. The use of the brand name 'Empress' and the fact that it was bottled in Oporto for a London merchant tends to suggest otherwise.
(Queen Victoria, who died in 1901, was also Empress of India)
Tom
A sound bottle might auction in London for £200-250, and retail for £350-400.
Allowing for the uplift on US prices, a US retail price should be around $1000-1200.
Although 1896 was a widely declared year, there is no guarantee that this is in fact a vintage port. The use of the brand name 'Empress' and the fact that it was bottled in Oporto for a London merchant tends to suggest otherwise.
(Queen Victoria, who died in 1901, was also Empress of India)
Tom
Thanks Tom!
When I responded to the women initially, I explained that my best guess (not knowing the "Empress" or the UK Merchant on the label) was that it was a Colheita and that the 1896 vintage was a beautful post-Phylloxera vintage which was generally declared by quite a few Shippers and the grapes that made up her bottle were likely to have been of a very fine quality.
I only wish there was a way to find out if the Richard Brooks & Co. still exists in London and if not, whatever happened to them.
Lastly, I did suggest that she call the shop in Cleveland Ohio (of all places for a Port like that to be on the shelves) that is carrying that same wine, regardless of their silly asking price.
When I responded to the women initially, I explained that my best guess (not knowing the "Empress" or the UK Merchant on the label) was that it was a Colheita and that the 1896 vintage was a beautful post-Phylloxera vintage which was generally declared by quite a few Shippers and the grapes that made up her bottle were likely to have been of a very fine quality.
I only wish there was a way to find out if the Richard Brooks & Co. still exists in London and if not, whatever happened to them.
Lastly, I did suggest that she call the shop in Cleveland Ohio (of all places for a Port like that to be on the shelves) that is carrying that same wine, regardless of their silly asking price.
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
The saga continues:
I just got off the phone with the store in Cleveland. He obtained several bottles of this 30 years ago from Carl Hope, an importer of the product. He told me that they have actually sold bottles at that price and still have some bottles left. He described the bottle and it is the same as ours. He said there is a back label. I will have to check with my father. He also said it was bottled in that year and it was an outstanding year. He also said that unless we have taken care of it, it is probably not good. He said it had to be standing, which it was and the cork should have been changed every 15 years and of course not subjected to temperature changes. The cork was never changed and I can't vouch for the temperature except it was in a contained place behind a bar that my parents own and was probably at a fairly consistent temperature. I didn't know what else to ask or what I would do with the bottle at this time. How does one determine if it is still good? I find this rather intriguing.
Any other thoughts or questions that come to mind?
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Hi xxxxxxx,
Thanks so much xxxxx. Do have your father check right away about the back label itself, as it might contain important information. This guy in Cleveland is not correct. This bottle would be fine laying on its side with the cork remaining moist. I have Port bottles back to 1815 and NONE are left standing up for the cork to dry out. This is NOT Madeira which is fine to stand up during long term storage. I also find it odd that he said this (I assume he means 1896) was the year of the bottling. It says "Vintage 1896" from what I can see and at that time, (similar but slightly different from today) Vintage Port bottling did not take place until at least 2 years and often times 3 year after the harvest. That would mean 1898-'99 at the earliest. Also if it is not a Vintage Port, but a Colheita from the 1896 vintage, it would have remained in wood for a minimum of 7 years but MOST likely, considerably longer. So, I don't think you are necessarily obtaining very accurate information from Cleveland. However, the back label may be very telling as that is where the date of bottling is usually listed. First have your father look. If not back label, call the store back and ask them if they could possibly read what is on it to you OR if the guy seems friendly enough, ask him to send you a digital photo of the back label.
Lastly, although there are some folks with more money than sense ... an unknown brand like the Empress, by a most likely defunct Brit wine merchant: Richard Brooks ... should be well under $500 at auction today, and that is if it was impeccably stored. Your bottle although still possibly alive and well (MAYBE) has been stored at room temp for a very long time and who knows how good it is. You are probably in better shape if it is a Colheita than a Vintage Port in terms of the quality left in the bottle.
Please continue the hunt and keep me in the loop. I love stories like this. : )
Best regards,
Roy
I just got off the phone with the store in Cleveland. He obtained several bottles of this 30 years ago from Carl Hope, an importer of the product. He told me that they have actually sold bottles at that price and still have some bottles left. He described the bottle and it is the same as ours. He said there is a back label. I will have to check with my father. He also said it was bottled in that year and it was an outstanding year. He also said that unless we have taken care of it, it is probably not good. He said it had to be standing, which it was and the cork should have been changed every 15 years and of course not subjected to temperature changes. The cork was never changed and I can't vouch for the temperature except it was in a contained place behind a bar that my parents own and was probably at a fairly consistent temperature. I didn't know what else to ask or what I would do with the bottle at this time. How does one determine if it is still good? I find this rather intriguing.
Any other thoughts or questions that come to mind?
------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi xxxxxxx,
Thanks so much xxxxx. Do have your father check right away about the back label itself, as it might contain important information. This guy in Cleveland is not correct. This bottle would be fine laying on its side with the cork remaining moist. I have Port bottles back to 1815 and NONE are left standing up for the cork to dry out. This is NOT Madeira which is fine to stand up during long term storage. I also find it odd that he said this (I assume he means 1896) was the year of the bottling. It says "Vintage 1896" from what I can see and at that time, (similar but slightly different from today) Vintage Port bottling did not take place until at least 2 years and often times 3 year after the harvest. That would mean 1898-'99 at the earliest. Also if it is not a Vintage Port, but a Colheita from the 1896 vintage, it would have remained in wood for a minimum of 7 years but MOST likely, considerably longer. So, I don't think you are necessarily obtaining very accurate information from Cleveland. However, the back label may be very telling as that is where the date of bottling is usually listed. First have your father look. If not back label, call the store back and ask them if they could possibly read what is on it to you OR if the guy seems friendly enough, ask him to send you a digital photo of the back label.
Lastly, although there are some folks with more money than sense ... an unknown brand like the Empress, by a most likely defunct Brit wine merchant: Richard Brooks ... should be well under $500 at auction today, and that is if it was impeccably stored. Your bottle although still possibly alive and well (MAYBE) has been stored at room temp for a very long time and who knows how good it is. You are probably in better shape if it is a Colheita than a Vintage Port in terms of the quality left in the bottle.
Please continue the hunt and keep me in the loop. I love stories like this. : )
Best regards,
Roy
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
- Tom Archer
- Posts: 2790
- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 8:09 pm
- Location: Near Saffron Walden, England
Tom,
I thought about that, but figured they have ALWAYS been J&B. I did a pretty thorough search of my library with old books for the UK, with no luck. Richard Brooks and various permutations also had me googling for an hour with zero luck.
I thought about that, but figured they have ALWAYS been J&B. I did a pretty thorough search of my library with old books for the UK, with no luck. Richard Brooks and various permutations also had me googling for an hour with zero luck.
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
- Tom Archer
- Posts: 2790
- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 8:09 pm
- Location: Near Saffron Walden, England
- John Danza
- Posts: 495
- Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 11:10 pm
- Location: Naperville, Illinois, United States of America - USA
Hi Tom and Roy,
Alfred Brooks bought the firm of Justerini's in 1830 and added his name at that time. That's according to the history on their website. Given this, it's unlikely that this bottling has anything to do with them.
http://www.justerinis.com/Info/OurRoyalWarrants.aspx
John Danza
Alfred Brooks bought the firm of Justerini's in 1830 and added his name at that time. That's according to the history on their website. Given this, it's unlikely that this bottling has anything to do with them.
http://www.justerinis.com/Info/OurRoyalWarrants.aspx
John Danza