I'd be interested in your thoughts on this article.
Madeira's Resurgence!
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Madeira's Resurgence!
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
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Eric Ifune
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- Location: Las Vegas, Nevada, United States of America - USA
Re: Madeira's Resurgence!
Everyone talks about Estufa, but no one recommends wines made that way. Just a good story I guess. The better articles actually talk about Canteiro wines.
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Alan Gardner
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Re: Madeira's Resurgence!
A little late to this discussion - but isn't it 'only' the Madeira Wine Company that uses the canteiro system. If so, the "better articles" may be influenced by the source of their material.
Has anybody actually done a comparison (blind or otherwise) of the estufagem vs. canteiro? My 'understanding' is that there are various types of estufagem, ranging from coils through jackets, plus sloow through 'faster' temperature adjustments.
Has anybody actually done a comparison (blind or otherwise) of the estufagem vs. canteiro? My 'understanding' is that there are various types of estufagem, ranging from coils through jackets, plus sloow through 'faster' temperature adjustments.
Re: Madeira's Resurgence!
Yes Alan. As well as using cement vs. stainless steel tanks for the estufagem process to take place. That being said, Canteiro is clearly the best method, for aging Madeira in wood. The slow aging may be far more expensive, but the results are pretty stark in comparison to the brief and relatively inexpensive estufa aging that is far more like pasteurization.
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
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Alan Gardner
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- Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2007 8:37 am
- Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Madeira's Resurgence!
Thanks Roy,
I accept 'at face value' that a slower change in temperature is 'probably' more beneficial (in the case of madeira) - but I resist the comparison to pasteurization - I don't see them as akin, in any way.
And I have a few other 'questions' (unfortunately no answers) about these processes.
In Noel Cossart's book (Madeira, the island vineyard; incidentally my 'bible' on Madeira) he discusses the Habersham "estufa do sol" - which seems to be very close to a canteiro - and says it results in concentration and darkening - although I find the MWC madeiras 'lighter than most'. Of course, adding colouring is also permitted - but too many variables!
Also, there are several variations within the estufa process (again from Cossart) - is there really a difference (eventually) between the 'armazen de calor' estufagem process, where the 'room' is heated by hot water pipes and the casks not heated directly - the chemist in me suggests that the heat of the sun is no different than the heat from a radiator (but I am prepared to believe that a 'natural' process where the ambient temperature falls at night and rises during the day could affect the resulting wine - but primarily because of oxidation - the small expansion and contraction would lead to oxygen being repeatedly drawn into the cask - in very small quantities).
With all your contacts - is there any way that these 'theories' can be tested in practice? Surely the 'young turks' (although now 'not as young') must have done some tests here. Maybe they'd love to have a 'consumer testing panel'!
I accept 'at face value' that a slower change in temperature is 'probably' more beneficial (in the case of madeira) - but I resist the comparison to pasteurization - I don't see them as akin, in any way.
And I have a few other 'questions' (unfortunately no answers) about these processes.
In Noel Cossart's book (Madeira, the island vineyard; incidentally my 'bible' on Madeira) he discusses the Habersham "estufa do sol" - which seems to be very close to a canteiro - and says it results in concentration and darkening - although I find the MWC madeiras 'lighter than most'. Of course, adding colouring is also permitted - but too many variables!
Also, there are several variations within the estufa process (again from Cossart) - is there really a difference (eventually) between the 'armazen de calor' estufagem process, where the 'room' is heated by hot water pipes and the casks not heated directly - the chemist in me suggests that the heat of the sun is no different than the heat from a radiator (but I am prepared to believe that a 'natural' process where the ambient temperature falls at night and rises during the day could affect the resulting wine - but primarily because of oxidation - the small expansion and contraction would lead to oxygen being repeatedly drawn into the cask - in very small quantities).
With all your contacts - is there any way that these 'theories' can be tested in practice? Surely the 'young turks' (although now 'not as young') must have done some tests here. Maybe they'd love to have a 'consumer testing panel'!