Hey everyone, I bought a variety of wines as part of the FLOP offer, which included several bottles of Kopke Vintage 2011 port. I haven't seen a tasting note in the database, and I was surprised that the price was so low, even with the discount... obviously the house is best known for their tawnies but curious if anyone can comment or give a tasting profile for their vintage (especially given how terrific the 2011 declared year was).
I'm not planning on selling any of my wines--I enjoy drinking them too much--but I was curious if people see the 2011 vintage prices going up over time. I have been surprised how "cheap" (always relative) a lot of vintage ports are on the auction houses and wonder if there is a real value to holding onto these wines as an investment?
Charles
Kopke Vintage Port 2011
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Re: Kopke Vintage Port 2011
Port is a bit weird in the wine world, as it's prices don't really appreciate much for quite a while. They'll go up eventually, but Port will probably never be a good financial investment.
Just take a look on winesearcher.com for proof - you can still find 1985 Vintage Ports in the $85 range, and that's for top-tier names. Granted, that's a significant increase over their release price, but it's not a dramatic change. It's only about what new releases go for - as I recall the top tier 2011 Vintage Ports were released at $80 - $90. Of course, the prices we see in FTLOP buying opportunities are well below release, so you could see some immediate appreciation simply due to that fact.
Just take a look on winesearcher.com for proof - you can still find 1985 Vintage Ports in the $85 range, and that's for top-tier names. Granted, that's a significant increase over their release price, but it's not a dramatic change. It's only about what new releases go for - as I recall the top tier 2011 Vintage Ports were released at $80 - $90. Of course, the prices we see in FTLOP buying opportunities are well below release, so you could see some immediate appreciation simply due to that fact.
Glenn Elliott
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Re: Kopke Vintage Port 2011
So I assume my investments will make 8%. Sometimes they do better, sometimes worse, but that figure has been working pretty well for me. (It is below the CAGR of the S&P 500 for the last 40, 60, 80 years when dividends are reinvested.) Taking Glenn's $85 bottle of 1985 VP, you would have to paid about $8.50 for that in 1987 to match that 8% return, with no storage costs. Anyone know what 1985 VPs were going for upon release? I suspect it was more than $8.50.
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Re: Kopke Vintage Port 2011
The 1977s and 1985s, except for the Fonseca anomalously given 100 points by James Suckling, went at the top end for $25-32.50 around Detroit. I bought mostly Grahams and Taylors from those vintages.Eric Menchen wrote:So I assume my investments will make 8%. Sometimes they do better, sometimes worse, but that figure has been working pretty well for me. (It is below the CAGR of the S&P 500 for the last 40, 60, 80 years when dividends are reinvested.) Taking Glenn's $85 bottle of 1985 VP, you would have to paid about $8.50 for that in 1987 to match that 8% return, with no storage costs. Anyone know what 1985 VPs were going for upon release? I suspect it was more than $8.50.
Re: Kopke Vintage Port 2011
The first Vintage Ports I bought by the case upon release was the 1983 vintage in late 1985. All seven producers that I purchased were selling for $19.99 at my fave shop in DC at the time and 1985. For 1985s, I paid between $25 and $35 in late 1987, mostly from Winexchange (was called Liquorexchange back then, till early 1990s) and Tinamou (the latter no longer exists).
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com