Too much to drink? An amazing local story of survival!
Moderators: Glenn E., Roy Hersh, Andy Velebil
Too much to drink? An amazing local story of survival!
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
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Andy Velebil
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WOW, keep her away from my cellar.
On a different note, they arrested her based on what she MIGHT do again. They may have some issues with this in court down the road. SInce when can we arrest someone because we think they will do something. If that was the case, then all the drug dealers and gang members should also be arrested....I'm by no means defending her, she sounds like an arse, but that part of the story caught my eye.
On a different note, they arrested her based on what she MIGHT do again. They may have some issues with this in court down the road. SInce when can we arrest someone because we think they will do something. If that was the case, then all the drug dealers and gang members should also be arrested....I'm by no means defending her, she sounds like an arse, but that part of the story caught my eye.
Andy Velebil Good wine is a good familiar creature if it be well used. William Shakespeare http://www.fortheloveofport.com
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Todd Pettinger
- Posts: 2022
- Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:59 am
- Location: Sherwood Park, Alberta, Canada
This arrest brings up what could turn out to be quite a topic of debate (especially in the US.)
She will likely sue the police force for arresting her without cause. I suppose it depends exactly on which charge is being pressed under which law or laws, and I am certainly no expert - especially when it comes to US law, but don't you have to be in the commission of a crime or with reasonable intent to be committing that crime (i.e. inserting the key into the starter while drunk) ??
I know here we have a law and people have been arrested for intent to operate a motor vehicle while over the limit, but they were opening the car door, sitting down, strapping the seat belt on (sometimes!) and/or starting the engine. I heard of stories like this and in my much earlier days of bar hopping, to ensure that there was no chance of being arrested, once asked a police office who happened to be cruising through the parking lot of a bar (where I was clearly drunk, but without intention of driving), to open my car door using my keys and then hang onto the keys while I climbed into the car to grab my wallet from its hiding place so I could pay for a cab ride home. The office looked at me like I was on glue (crazy if that doesn't translate over the Atlantic) and bitched about it, but when I told him I didn't want to get arrested for intent to drive he loosened up and helped me out.
If this lady is sitting at home, not intending to drive, I'm not sure how they can make a case that will be accepted in court.
But, I am a huge opponent of drunk driving, so I think it is wonderful that the police force are taking a proactive step towards preventing a tragedy from occurring. All too often, police forces are accused of being handcuffed by the law and NOT taking appropriate steps to prevent foreseeable tragedies from occurring. While I think they may have some trouble "making this one stick" it is a good sign that they are trying. This is, after all, what they are charged with in their duty - serving and protecting.
It would be interesting to get the opinions of our resident police officers on this matter.
Todd
She will likely sue the police force for arresting her without cause. I suppose it depends exactly on which charge is being pressed under which law or laws, and I am certainly no expert - especially when it comes to US law, but don't you have to be in the commission of a crime or with reasonable intent to be committing that crime (i.e. inserting the key into the starter while drunk) ??
I know here we have a law and people have been arrested for intent to operate a motor vehicle while over the limit, but they were opening the car door, sitting down, strapping the seat belt on (sometimes!) and/or starting the engine. I heard of stories like this and in my much earlier days of bar hopping, to ensure that there was no chance of being arrested, once asked a police office who happened to be cruising through the parking lot of a bar (where I was clearly drunk, but without intention of driving), to open my car door using my keys and then hang onto the keys while I climbed into the car to grab my wallet from its hiding place so I could pay for a cab ride home. The office looked at me like I was on glue (crazy if that doesn't translate over the Atlantic) and bitched about it, but when I told him I didn't want to get arrested for intent to drive he loosened up and helped me out.
If this lady is sitting at home, not intending to drive, I'm not sure how they can make a case that will be accepted in court.
But, I am a huge opponent of drunk driving, so I think it is wonderful that the police force are taking a proactive step towards preventing a tragedy from occurring. All too often, police forces are accused of being handcuffed by the law and NOT taking appropriate steps to prevent foreseeable tragedies from occurring. While I think they may have some trouble "making this one stick" it is a good sign that they are trying. This is, after all, what they are charged with in their duty - serving and protecting.
It would be interesting to get the opinions of our resident police officers on this matter.
Todd
Todd,
If your interested, we have different laws over this side of the Pond. There is an exception to having to be caught commiting a crime, and its called conspiracy to commit a crime. Its complicated, but if you are caught planning to commit a criminal act, like if the woman was shouting she was going to get in the car and drive when it was obvious she was very drunk, a pre-emptive arrest could be made, but the evidence wouldn't usually hold up for a Conviction. It would hold up for reasonable suspicion, which is all the arresting Officer needed and therefore the woman couldn't successfully sue.
Specifically in the Drink/Driving laws, we also have an offence of being Drunk in Charge of a motor vehicle(As opposed to actually driving it). You have to prove some intent to use the vehicle, but it covers the classic case of the drunk leaving the Pub and walking to his car with the keys in his hand. Again a great preventitive arrest, but harder to prove in Court than the ordinary 'being caught in the act of an actual ofence'. All these cases have the advantage of not letting the dope get in the car and driving off, where the real problems can start.
So I'm sure thats as clear as Mud!
Alan
If your interested, we have different laws over this side of the Pond. There is an exception to having to be caught commiting a crime, and its called conspiracy to commit a crime. Its complicated, but if you are caught planning to commit a criminal act, like if the woman was shouting she was going to get in the car and drive when it was obvious she was very drunk, a pre-emptive arrest could be made, but the evidence wouldn't usually hold up for a Conviction. It would hold up for reasonable suspicion, which is all the arresting Officer needed and therefore the woman couldn't successfully sue.
Specifically in the Drink/Driving laws, we also have an offence of being Drunk in Charge of a motor vehicle(As opposed to actually driving it). You have to prove some intent to use the vehicle, but it covers the classic case of the drunk leaving the Pub and walking to his car with the keys in his hand. Again a great preventitive arrest, but harder to prove in Court than the ordinary 'being caught in the act of an actual ofence'. All these cases have the advantage of not letting the dope get in the car and driving off, where the real problems can start.
So I'm sure thats as clear as Mud!
Alan
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Todd Pettinger
- Posts: 2022
- Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:59 am
- Location: Sherwood Park, Alberta, Canada
Thanks Alan, it makes sense. Similar to the "intent to operate a motor vehicle while under the influence" law here in Canada as well. And for a while there, we had an anti-terrorism law (post 9-11, but struck down just a few months ago by a majority opposition government) that would allow the police basically carte-blanche to arrest and detain, indefinitely, anyone suspected of plotting or conspiracy to plot or undertake an act of terrorism. In both cases, and in the case of English law apparently, it prevents something BAD from happening - which is usually a good thing! :)
Todd
Todd
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Andy Velebil
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Hmm, maybe I'll bring ye 'ol breath tester with me next time I see you....could be interesting 
Andy Velebil Good wine is a good familiar creature if it be well used. William Shakespeare http://www.fortheloveofport.com
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
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Luc Gauthier
- Posts: 1271
- Joined: Thu Dec 28, 2006 7:38 pm
- Location: Montréal Canada
Todd , I was 8 yr , when the War Measures Act was enacted in 1970 here in La Belle Province .tpettinger wrote:Thanks Alan, it makes sense. Similar to the "intent to operate a motor vehicle while under the influence" law here in Canada as well. And for a while there, we had an anti-terrorism law (post 9-11, but struck down just a few months ago by a majority opposition government) that would allow the police basically carte-blanche to arrest and detain, indefinitely, anyone suspected of plotting or conspiracy to plot or undertake an act of terrorism. In both cases, and in the case of English law apparently, it prevents something BAD from happening - which is usually a good thing! :)
Todd
It was an anti-terrorism law taken to the extreme . ( for a democratic society ) Do the ends justify the means ?
Vintage avant jeunesse/or the other way around . . .
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Todd Pettinger
- Posts: 2022
- Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:59 am
- Location: Sherwood Park, Alberta, Canada
It sure is a tricky issue isn't it?
How does a country balance between protecting its citizens against the threat of terrorism vs crossing the line for human rights?
Slippery slope that one. Very contentious issue (not that I want to start a debate on it - there are other forums for that!
We should just all be able to drink more port and be happy!
( just not too much if we';re gonna drive!)
Todd
How does a country balance between protecting its citizens against the threat of terrorism vs crossing the line for human rights?
Slippery slope that one. Very contentious issue (not that I want to start a debate on it - there are other forums for that!
We should just all be able to drink more port and be happy!
( just not too much if we';re gonna drive!)Todd
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Luc Gauthier
- Posts: 1271
- Joined: Thu Dec 28, 2006 7:38 pm
- Location: Montréal Canada
Before taking such an action that has tremendous societal implications , one should , always , I repeat always , decant and enjoy the warmth that envelops you . . .
After all , there were a few VP's available ( and at a very good price ) . . .
Luc
After all , there were a few VP's available ( and at a very good price ) . . .
Luc
Vintage avant jeunesse/or the other way around . . .