Do Tannins Get in the Way of Your Enjoying Port?

Post by **Roy Hersh** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:48 pm

Whether it is LBV, Ruby Reserve or Vintage or any others you care to include ... do you enjoy Port more when the tannins are .... ?

Al B. · Post by **Al B.** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:41 pm

For my drinking enjoyment I like the tannins to be present, but soft and subdued. I love the chocolately taste that they give, the slight dryness and the structure to the wine.

However, I dislike it when they are dominating. If they are so powerful that they suck your cheeks dry and make your mouth feel like your cheeks are stuck to your teeth then this is a wine that I do not enjoy.

The Grahams 2001 LBV that I have in front of me is an example of a wine with tannins probably about as pronounced as I enjoy. They are there, you can taste them in the mid-palate and the give a long, lingering aftertaste of milk chocolate and dry cheeks but they do not detract from the rest of the wine's composition. Nor do they dominate or overpower the other components of the wine but they add another layer of complexity and interest.

Would I enjoy port without tannins in? I don't think so. I tried some of this from the lagars last October. It was nice, but it was just fruit juice. Even if I had laced some with Vodka it would not have had the structure of port.

However, I don't suppose that I will ever really get the chance to try port without tannins as I can't imagine that there is a way to make it!

Alex

Post by **Andy Velebil** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:59 pm

Al B. wrote:For my drinking enjoyment I like the tannins to be present, but soft and subdued....

However, I dislike it when they are dominating. If they are so powerful that they suck your cheeks dry and make your mouth feel like your cheeks are stuck to your teeth then this is a wine that I do not enjoy.

Would I enjoy port without tannins in? I don't think so.....

Alex

Alex summed up my thoughts exactly.

Todd Pettinger · Post by **Todd Pettinger** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 7:26 pm

I hate being a "yes man" but me three behind Alex and Andy.

My Offley Boa Vista 2003 seems to have the over-powering tannins that detract from the enjoyment I have of a port. Realizing of course that this is far to young to be drinking now, I accept the fact that the tannins (hopefully) will mellow over time. If so, I'll be drinking that Offley around my 90th birthday!

(60 years)

If not, some time around my 70th b-day, I will be having an awful lot of bolognaise sauce flavoured with Offley 2003 VP!

Todd

Post by **Roy Hersh** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 12:18 pm

Todd,

It is quite common for such an infant to have tannins that are over the top. Often times it takes 5+ years to notice them even beginning to integrate. Some producers chose to make a more tannic style, like Taylor that is not real user friendly early on.

Others make a much more fruit forward style that has solid structure, yet is built for mid-term aging potential and won't stay in great shape 30+ years out. I see nothing wrong with this as long as the buyer knows what to expect.

Don't give up on the Offley. :)

Todd Pettinger · Post by **Todd Pettinger** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 3:15 pm

Oh I won't - and was expecting it to be very young. Just how over-the-top tannic, I didn't foresee - I would expect that of a Taylor or Fonseca from what I understand (which I will not open young - a point on which Alan and I completely agree!!) Those bigger names that I can't afford to open young have the reputation as such (drink'em old, because they are unsufferable when very young!)

It remains to be seen how good they will be in 2-3 decades from now, but I fully expect them to throw some sediment, mellow out considerably and hopefully be one that I look back at and laugh about as the biggest "steal-of-a-deal" I have ever had the pleasure of being on the good-side of!

Todd

Post by **Roy Hersh** » Mon Jun 25, 2007 12:47 pm

Todd,

I have a very strong feeling that you are in for a heck of a long Port love affair and this was just the very first great deal to come your way. It will happen again, sooner rather than later.

I'd still like to hear more and varied opinions on Port and tannins. Thanks!

Scott Anaya · Post by **Scott Anaya** » Tue Jun 26, 2007 7:33 pm

Whether it is LBV, Ruby Reserve or Vintage or any others you care to include ... do you enjoy Port more when the tannins are .... ?

I like tannins and like them to be noticeable in any form of Port I am drinking, but in balance though is best. Maybe this is because I am rebelling against the new world- easy drinking- fruit driven wines in vogue these days?

And maybe I am still very early in my early in my VP drinking stage, but I like to drink young VP at this point of my life (I'm thirty-something years old) because I really want to mark the evolution of some known VP's--ones that I have drunk upon relelase and re-visit every two years or so. I think this is helping me and will definetly help me later in life to more fully understand VP.

Or maybe I'm just a tannin junkie? I'm sure there is the equivalent of a 1-800 help line I can call in London to cure my problem!

Raj Patil · Post by **Raj Patil** » Tue Jun 26, 2007 7:48 pm

I wouldn't go as far to say they get in the way, but I like the tannins present to give the mouthfeel and finish, however I definately prefer them integrated and subdued. When drinking a port that is younger than 20 years I expect a tannic grip and it doesn't lessen my experience though. I'm currently aging bottles of ruby and LBV to see if the tannins dissipate and if the fruit and structure hold up enought to be the magic substitute for a VP when an occasion isn't really justified for a VP.

nicos neocleous · Post by **nicos neocleous** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:23 am

Roy,

For me, when alcohol stands out in Port, it is more of a barrier to enjoyment than tannins.

Nicos

Todd Pettinger · Post by **Todd Pettinger** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:27 pm

I think I agree with you Nicos, generally speaking, although I recently has a tannic monster (2003 Ofley Boa Vista) which was so mouth-puckeringly tannic that I could not finish the bottle. The last quarter of the bottle has sat in my liquor cabinet upstairs for I think now three weeks. I may revisit it this weekend just to try it out, but this was the first case where non-integrated, pervasive alcohol blew, which I normally find detracting and worthy of a significant drop in my ratings of a port, to be a minor issue compared to the tannins. Yikes! And I have nearly 18 more bottles of this!

I certainly hope Roy is right and that it will lose a lot of this strong tannin influence over the next 15-20 years, or I'll be designing an AWFUL lot of port-infused recipes for cooking with Offley Boa Vista

Todd

Gary Banker · Post by **Gary Banker** » Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:11 am

I like to have some tannins present, but not overpowering. I have some 1985 Taylor that has enough tannins to add a little zing to the port. It's a nice aspect that adds some variety to drinking VP. I would not want all port to be this way.

Gary

Post by **Roy Hersh** » Tue Jul 17, 2007 8:52 pm

Gary,

So what is your overall opinion of the 1985 Taylor VP?