more blind 2007 cask samples

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Glenn E.
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more blind 2007 cask samples

Post by Glenn E. »

Roy and I have been doing another flight of cask samples this week - 4 bottles instead of 3 this time - and like the last time I created one of these posts we've already completed tastings on 2 consecutive evenings and have a final tasting tomorrow afternoon. (Well, that's all I've done on these samples... I think Roy tastes them 3-4 times every day.)

I find it a lot easier to post the un-labeled notes in a thread like this and then break them out into separate tasting note threads once we've done the reveal. So here we go with the notes for the first two days:

Day 1

Bottle #1
Color: inky with a good purple tone. 3/16" fade at the rim.
Nose: very grapey, no alcohol to speak of, lots of purple fruit and some blueberry.
Palate: medium heavy body, mellow purple fruit, nicely sweet and full with fine grain tannins. The fruits are so powerful that the tannins are a bit hard to detect, but they're very much there.
Finish: lots of purple fruit followed by a tannic grip, then eventually some grape stem.

Initial rating: 90-93 points, raised to 91-94 by the end of the evening.

Bottle #2
Color: inky with a ruby-purple tone. 2/16" fade at the rim, making it the most opaque of the group.
Nose: paper/dust/charcoal that's somewhat difficult to identify, a faint minty note, and an impression of tart red fruit
Palate: zowie... this is a tannic beast. The tannins are almost powdery, as if you're drinking a cup of talcum powder. The fruits (that survive the tannins) are red and raw, zesty and tart. There's also some heat.
Finish: tannins and heat are about the only things that survive

Initial rating: 85-88. The tannins are insane so the entire Port seems out of balance.

Bottle #3
Color: inky (are you detecting a pattern?) purple. 3/16" fade at the rim.
Nose: Rose's lime juice, some fragrant alcohol, mulberry/black raspberry, and a very faint sour note. Very nice.
Palate: medium+ body, good grip, fresh purple berries, and a bit of heat.
Finish: purple fruit, some tannins, and then a mixed fruit compote-like note. There's heat throughout and some grape stem at the end.

Initial rating: 89-92.

Bottle #4
Color: inky purple with a 3/16" fade at the rim. Pretty standard for a cask sample.
Nose: needs coaxing to show a mixed bag of mellow red and fresh purple fruits, some fragrant alcohol, and then also some more generic "heat"-like alcohol. The fragrant alcohol might also be called a floral note depending on the person, but to me it seems like it is alcohol-based.
Palate: initially sweet, then some mellow purple fruits. Not as immediately pleasant as Bottle #1, but with more complexity so ultimately probably better.
Finish: quite long, and a nice mixture of fruit, tannins, and heat that fades evenly.

Initial rating: 91-94.

Day 2 - We tasted out of order today at Roy's recommendation so that bottles #1 and #4 could be tasted together, followed by bottles #2 and #3. Roy felt that was how they paired up stylistically. I wasn't so sure about that, but hey the man's got 30+ years of experience on me so who am I to argue? :lol: I'm going to post them in numerical order, though, so that I don't screw 'em up when I move them over to the tasting note forum.

Bottle #1
Color: no change
Nose: less grapey than Day 1, some fragrant alcohol, tart/sour purple fruits, but still some blueberries to go with them.
Palate: feels like it has lost body - it's just medium today. All of the fruit, sweetness, and fullness seem lessened or muted as well. The tannins are more evident today, and there's also some acidity now that I didn't notice on Day 1.
Finish: heat, fairly tart red to maybe purple fruits, and some stem. Not as nice as Day 1.

New rating: 89-92. Definitely not as nice today. I struggled with a rating, not quite sure how to deal with the drop off.

Bottle #2
Color: very slightly more fade, but still pretty obviously less than the other three bottles.
Nose: alcohol, dusty paper, a faint sour note, and some tart raspberries. The sour note and the raspberries go hand-in-hand.
Palate: an initial sweetness followed by heat, big grippy tannins, and a pepper-ish note. (a la black pepper, not jalapeno pepper.)
Finish: tannins, dry fruit, and oddly no stem or skin impression. I say oddly, because my experience is that stem/skin is something a Vintage Port will pick up with air time, not something it will lose.

New rating: 88-91. It's significantly better, but still doesn't feel like an epic Port. I toyed with giving it 89-92, but ultimately decided that even though it was significantly improved over Day 1, it still just wasn't quite up to the level of the other three bottles.

Bottle #3
Color: no change
Nose: an odd bird tonight - alcohol, faint green pepper, smoke, something floral (or possibly fragrant alcohol again), and mellow red raspberries. I double-checked the nose later and pulled the same green pepper and smoke, so it wasn't just a passing fancy.
Palate: mellow sweetness, black pepper, the high end of pleasant heat, good grip, and a slight bite.
Finish: tangy fruit, some heat, and some grape skin. Overall pretty mellow and pleasant.

New rating: 89-92. I struggled long and hard with this rating because the Port showed so differently on Day 2. But I eventually decided that it was neither better nor worse, and so deserved the same score.

Note: after doing the ratings and while finishing off the glasses, I noted a distinct note of Chimay beer if I tasted #2 and then immediately tasted #3. There was something about the switch from 2 to 3 that created it, because no other pairing produced the effect.

Bottle #4
Color: no change
Nose: still reticent and in need of encouragement to show. Dusty minerals, some neutral alcohol, purple and black fruits, and maybe a bit of smoke.
Palate: medium+ body which is heavier than Day 1. It's trying to be sweet and mellow, but isn't quite there. Some fresh red fruits are intruding and disrupting the mellow party.
Finish: tart and sour fruits (mostly red and purple), tannins, and grape skin

New rating: 89-92. Another somewhat disappointing showing that just wasn't as nice as Day 1. If offered one bottle from the three with equal ratings (1, 3, 4) I'd probably take 4 by a hair.
Glenn Elliott
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Re: more blind 2007 cask samples

Post by Roy Hersh »

The tannins are insane so the entire Port seems out of balance.
It is a ton of fun for me to read your TNs and especially since I can relate directly to the wines. I am enjoying watching your palate improve with these youngsters and am pleased at the progression of comfort in developing scoring ranges. :clap: :clap: :clap:

Your quote above made me smile. Although I certainly can understand the comment, although I am anxious to find out which Port that one is ... actually I love when we do the unveiling because I may have a solid palate for this exercise, but I rarely guess the right producer. I should say, "very very rarely." One thing I can say though is that although I have tasted these (only twice per day though and on day two three times for this batch of four) that the massive tannins in this Port are just baby fat that will integrate in time and is not an issue of balance, just the ability of this baby to age much longer than the other three.

Thanks for sharing your impressions Glenn! :thumbsup:
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
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Glenn E.
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Re: more blind 2007 cask samples

Post by Glenn E. »

Roy Hersh wrote:the massive tannins in this Port are just baby fat that will integrate in time and is not an issue of balance, just the ability of this baby to age much longer than the other three.
I'm sure it's just my inexperience showing... I just don't know what to make of these samples sometimes. I still have a hard enough time just recognizing the different components. I think I need a lot more practice before I'll be able to judge whether or not those components are present in appropriate quantities! :lol:

I can't wait to see how they've evolved this afternoon and then find out what they are. Last week's reveal was a lot of fun, and thinking back on it I think the most significant reveal for me was the Martinez. That was a very pleasant Port all week and was consistently my favorite for drinking now, so to see a reasonably big name on the bottle was pretty fun. This week's batch is so jumbled up for me that I really can't say which one I'm most interested in seeing revealed... they're all so close, yet so different.

I guess we'll see in another 4-5 hours!
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Re: more blind 2007 cask samples

Post by Roy Hersh »

I am looking forward to reading your further notes on these and especially before and after the reveal.
Ambition driven by passion, rather than money, is as strong an elixir as is Port. http://www.fortheloveofport.com
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Re: more blind 2007 cask samples

Post by Glenn E. »

Arrgh... my computer died right about the time my parents arrived, so doing anything organized on the internet over the weekend was rather difficult. I just dropped them off at the airport, though, and so will try to get the rest of my notes posted as soon as I've managed to straighten up the house. (I'm using my wife's computer now, which has a different keyboard, mouse, desk, monitor, etc, which all add up to making it more difficult to use. :wall: )
Glenn Elliott
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Re: more blind 2007 cask samples

Post by Glenn E. »

As with the first set of cask samples that Roy shared with me, I tasted two evenings in a row and then again on the afternoon of the 4th day. So "Day 3" of tasting occured on the 4th day that the Ports had been open. Roy tasted twice a day (or more) for all 4 days so has a more complete picture of the samples.

What I learned most from tasting this flight over the week is that I'm horribly bad at evaluating tannins. But more on that later. :wink:

Day 3

Bottle #1
Color: Very slightly more opaque. We do Day 3 in the afternoon so that we can use the natural afternoon light to check color and opacity, but I was surprised to find that #1 definitely seemed to be more opaque than previous days. With more natural light, I expected it to appear more transparent.
Nose: grape, red raspberry, and blueberry. Some fragrant alcohol, some very faint white pepper, and a nice tart/sour note.
Palate: medium body. Welch's grape juice, pepper, raspberry, and some heat. The tannins are back to feeling somewhat light and/or fine. They're there, they just don't grab you. There's also good acidity for balance.
Finish: fairly tangy, some moderately weak fruit, and some mild tannins.

Final comments: After dropping off the first day, this bottle seemed to hold pretty steady for me. Final score: 89-92.

Reveal: 2007 Smith Woodhouse Vintage Port. I was a little surprised by this since the last couple of SW Ports I've had have been better overall. As I recall Roy had this rated slightly higher, but not so much higher that I was concerned that my numbers were off.

Bottle #2
Color: less fade than Day 2, putting it back to where it was on Day 1. This bottle is clearly more opaque than the other three.
Nose: dusty cardboard (not corked!) or possibly minerals, tart purple fruits, and what feels like good heat.
Palate: huge, massive tannins. A little bit of dust or minerals. The fruits are a bit reserved, or possibly just being dominated by the tannins. The heat is mild and feels nice.
Finish: tannins and a bit of a soft bite. The finish feels weak, but it lingers forever.

Final comments: I had a very difficult time evaluating this bottle because - to me - the tannins were so far out of balance. Roy said that this bottle would have seemed perfectly normal in a lineup of 2003 cask samples because they were ALL brutal. I just couldn't get past them, though, and so didn't change my score much. Final score: 90-93.

Reveal: 2007 Sandeman Vintage Port. Roy smiled when the bottle was revealed - I think he may have suspected this bottle was the Sandeman. His score was significantly higher than mine, and when he explained it I could see where he was coming from. But as noted, I have problems evaluating the tannins and they're really powerful in this Port.

Bottle #3
Color: no change
Nose: fragrant alcohol, some faint dust, mellow purple fruits and bright red fruits.
Palate: grapey, purple and/or black fruits, some tartness, and a slight bite. The tannins grip lightly and are slightly grainy in texture.
Finish: a sour/tart note that was pushing the limit toward seeming bad, good tannic grip, a little bit of grape stem, and then that slight bite returns.

Final comments: the most consistent of the four for me, my score never changed. The Port, on the other hand, changed a lot. I just always felt like it was at about the same overall level score-wise. Final score: 89-92.

Reveal: 2007 Niepoort Pisca. This is a new Port from Niepoort and is either a single-quinta or single-vineyard type of offering (Roy couldn't remember which off the top of his head). I don't remember exactly, but I think Roy's score was higher than mine and pushing the edge of "normal" deviation. Probably another case of the tannins giving me fits, because even though this one wasn't nearly as bad as the Sandeman it was the 2nd most tannic of the group.

Bottle #4
Color: slightly more ruby in tone than before, putting it at almost exactly the same color as Bottle #2.
Nose: more relaxed than before, so needs less coaxing. Dusty minerals (which seems to be a theme for Day 3) and a medly of all the typical fruit colors (red, purple, black). The red fruits are brighter/fresher than the purple and black, which tend toward the mellow/ripe end of the spectrum. There's some nice heat from the alcohol, too.
Palate: mild tart raspberry, some heat, and some medium to light tannins. It also has a medium body, so overall a very nicely drinking Port.
Finish: some pleasant fruit, faint tannins, heat, and then finally some grape stem.

Final comments: my favorite of the four for drinking now. It doesn't seem to have quite as much long-term potential as 2 or 3, but that's splitting hairs because this one should still age nicely for 20-30 years. As with bottle #1, this one seemed to drop off after the first day but then hold pretty steady. Final score: 89-92.

Reveal: 2007 Gould Campbell Vintage Port. I've heard good things about this Port from others who have tried cask samples, so I was surprised that my score wasn't higher. I don't know if that's just another example of my inexperience with cask samples, or if we might have had a slightly off bottle.
Glenn Elliott
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