Have you ever seen a fraudulent Port bottle?

[Roy Hersh]

If so, was it in person, an auction catalogue ... or other venue? Please elaborate.

[Andy Velebil]

Yes, an old bottle of Croft VP at an offline several of us here attended. We never did figure out what was in the bottle, but it didn't even appear to be alcoholic. Then again, I wasn't about to taste it to find out.

[Roy Hersh]

Well that was a few years ago now. If YOU haven't seen any since, that is a good thing. I have a very well known Canadian Port expert who is hounding me on the quantity of fraudulent Ports he bought in the mid-1980's from a particular retailer/importer in CA. He's been on this topic for months trying to prove his point and to relieve his angst. Just wondering if others have had any similar experiences.

[Andy Velebil]

It's probably safe to say it's a rare occurrence.

[Andy Velebil]

Well that was a few years ago now. If YOU haven't seen any since, that is a good thing. I have a very well known Canadian Port expert who is hounding me on the quantity of fraudulent Ports he bought in the mid-1980's from a particular retailer/importer in CA. He's been on this topic for months trying to prove his point and to relieve his angst. Just wondering if others have had any similar experiences.

Roy
Can he send you pictures of what he thinks is counterfeit, then you post them here so he can remain anonymous. Between all of us here, we've probably seen close to every possible variance of labels, bottles, and capsules since they were required to all be bottled in Gaia.

[Moses Botbol]

I was leery of the Nacionals that came to the auction market about 6-8 months ago. I have never personally seen or had a vintage (beyond the Croft mentioned earlier) that I thought may be dubious. Port would be harder to counterfeit (than BDX) due to capsule and period era bottles. Sure a bottle here and there someone could fake, but getting a bunch of identical 1930's era bottles (faking let's say 1931 Noval) and getting the wax right is no easy feat.

[Jeff G.]

I believe I was drinking a warres 70? where a gould campbell cork fell out.

that was amusing, but Paul Symington checked the celo and verified that it was indeed the warres and that there may have been a cork mix up.

[Andy Velebil]

I was leery of the Nacionals that came to the auction market about 6-8 months ago.
.

How come?

[Andy Velebil]

I believe I was drinking a warres 70? where a gould campbell cork fell out.

that was amusing, but Paul Symington checked the celo and verified that it was indeed the warres and that there may have been a cork mix up.

Usually I've seen this with bottles that have been sold as a BOB after being bottled with the original cork, for both Port and dry wines here in the States. Always interesting to pull out a cork and find out what it was really intended to be or what producer made it for whoevers name was on the label.

[Moses Botbol]

I was leery of the Nacionals that came to the auction market about 6-8 months ago.
.

How come?

Gut feeling. Out of no where, the market is flooded with Nacionals. Never saw the bottles, so I could be way off the mark.

[Jeff G.]

I was leery of the Nacionals that came to the auction market about 6-8 months ago.
.

How come?

Gut feeling. Out of no where, the market is flooded with Nacionals. Never saw the bottles, so I could be way off the mark.

bottles looked legit

but yes they were at significant discount and for a HUGE vertical worth.

I believe I was bidding against a few of you here.

[Al B.]

Well that was a few years ago now. If YOU haven't seen any since, that is a good thing. I have a very well known Canadian Port expert who is hounding me on the quantity of fraudulent Ports he bought in the mid-1980's from a particular retailer/importer in CA. He's been on this topic for months trying to prove his point and to relieve his angst. Just wondering if others have had any similar experiences.

Roy
Can he send you pictures of what he thinks is counterfeit, then you post them here so he can remain anonymous. Between all of us here, we've probably seen close to every possible variance of labels, bottles, and capsules since they were required to all be bottled in Gaia.

Roy,

Did you manage to get any pictures of the dubious bottles? I don't think that I've ever bought a bottle of port that I thought was a fake, but I have bought some where the description and the actual bottle were quite different "Believed Taylor 1963" in a bottle with a Dow 1980 mould on the bottle, for example.

I'd be very interested to learn from someone else's experience, if I can.

Alex