Important PORT News!!!

[Roy Hersh]

http://www.thewinedetective.co.uk/blog/ ... book%22%7D

[Luc Gauthier]

A pre Phylloxera port or Noval Nacional 1931

[Roy Hersh]

Speakinng of which, by pure coincidence, I've come across the family that sold the Scion casks!

[Andy Velebil]

Speakinng of which, by pure coincidence, I've come across the family that sold the Scion casks!

Betcha their bummed they didn't sell it to TFP for more money

[Luc Gauthier]

I think bummed is an understatement .
It would be like saying the Douro valley is O.K.

[Eric Ifune]

Seems like a trend, bottling old casks and selling for premium prices.

[Moses Botbol]

Seems like a trend, bottling old casks and selling for premium prices.

I wonder how much the market can bare of this price point bottles? Sounds amazing and I really like all their wine and port; especially their tawny.

[Eric Menchen]

Speakinng of which, by pure coincidence, I've come across the family that sold the Scion casks!

Betcha their bummed they didn't sell it to TFP for more money

I wonder how much the market can bare of this price point bottles?

If the bottles aren't selling out, that family might not be so bummed. I'm sure TFP is making a nice margin on the Scion they are selling. If they are sitting on the bottles, that margin is effectively reduced.

[Al B.]

My understanding is that there is not much Scion left for the primary market. It seems these sort of ports sell rather well (thinking of the Dom Pedro 1853 and the Whitwam's Millennium 1881 as being other examples).

[Rob C.]

My understanding is that there is not much Scion left for the primary market. It seems these sort of ports sell rather well (thinking of the Dom Pedro 1853 and the Whitwam's Millennium 1881 as being other examples).

Agreed, i think there are enough people around to soak up these "prestige" releases and for whom the decision is as easy as whether to go for a couple of penny sweets.

That said, there does seem to be a fair bit of Scion floating around (and some at a £1k discount to the original offer price...)

[Mark L]

Thanks for this, Roy. I wonder how Scion and this compare in taste!

As long as other port houses don't start jumping on the band wagon and start releasing many pre-phyl vintage ports of their own, thus diluting the high end market for pre-phyl ports, these special bottles will -- in the long run -- keep their value quite well.

From my understanding, it's possible port houses WILL jump on the band wagon --- many of these old barrels used to be bought and blended into a 40 yr tawny. So finding an old barrel is not entirely so uncommon. The question will be if port houses start bottling the barrels (normally blended into a tawny) instead into crystal decanters for the "prestige" -- will the quality remain very high? (I have tasted the Scion on a few occasions and think it is phenomenal.) Or will they bank on the fact that there is a certain (though small) population of people out there who just want the 'rare' for the sake of its being 'rare' ....and won't actually drink it?

Personally, I think the whisky market (by comparison) is getting a little crazy with their 50 yr old releases (nice product placement in Skyfall) .... I remember when Bowmore's original 40 was "discovered" ... it was so unusual. And now every producer is releasing something at LEAST 40 yrs old on the market in a crystal decanter. I'm really not sure how long they can keep it up. I suppose if production is low, and they appeal to the 0.0001% of supremely wealthy people who just 'have to have it' then they'll keep making it. But I've heard from more than a few whisky collectors that the 'quality' of these releases just isn't there.... it's rare because of age, not because of how great it is! (at least not in QPR)

Thankfully, the other difference between whisky and this pre-phyl port is that pre-phyl port will disappear. Whereas whisky distilleries can always decide to keep a few barrels tucked away for an extra 10 years until they reach 50 and sell them for 100x more than a 40 yr old. And they can keep doing this.

So hopefully, again, in the long run, these special pre-phyl wines will remain just that --- special.

[Roy Hersh]

IMO, they will. I know of a few pre-Phyll. casks in Gaia and a handful in the Douro too. But they are becoming more and more scarce as families feel the pinch of the economy and unload some of the precious stash, or more so, see this as a quick way to bring in substantial cash flow.

Having just been touring the whiskey trail in Scotland last month, and top shops beforehand in Edinburgh, I was amazed at the luxury items being sold. In addition to those old bottlings you mention, what I found new to me ... as a non-drinker of whiskey until that trip ... was the single vintage goods going back to the 1960's and 1970's.

[Daniel R.]

IMO, they will. I know of a few pre-Phyll. casks in Gaia and a handful in the Douro too. But they are becoming more and more scarce as families feel the pinch of the economy and unload some of the precious stash, or more so, see this as a quick way to bring in substantial cash flow.

There is a big sale going on right now, not pre-Phyll, but clearly a family heirloom being sold because cash is needed. 1400 bottles that were filled recently from an old cask by a descendant of the Borges family. In Portugal being sold by retailer Wine o' Clockhttp://www.wineoclock.com.pt/, in the UK apparently auctioned by Bonhams.

News here:

http://forum.revistadevinhos.iol.pt/vie ... f=2&t=3254

and

http://www.theportforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6504

[Rob C.]

1400 bottles that were filled recently from an old cask by a descendant of the Borges family.

My understanding...which admittedly may be entirely wrong....is that these were bottled in 1947.

[Daniel R.]

1400 bottles that were filled recently from an old cask by a descendant of the Borges family.

My understanding...which admittedly may be entirely wrong....is that these were bottled in 194/quote]

You are correct Rob, my mistake. The more recent bottles were bottled in 1947. What happened now was certification by the IVDP (selo), re-corking, and new labels with Borges brand. Official note here:

http://www.ivv.min-agricultura.pt/np4/5112.html