For The Love Of Port

Hi!

I'm new to this forum, and would very much like your advice in the VP's of 2003.

I'm looking into these: Taylor, Fonseca and Niepoort.

Have already bought 2 bottles of Niepoort, and have a case of 6 waiting for me, if I decide to grab it.
However - for buying a case of 6 I'd like to be sure to make the right choice, and since I'm new to Ports, I would appreciate some advice from you here.

Oyvind,

Welocme to FTLOP and the the wonderful world of Port

If you are new to port I would suggest that you do not buy any bottles from the 2003 vintage. You would be better buying some mature Vintage Ports from the 1980's (probably cheaper than the 2003's ) so that you can find a style that you like.

Any Vintage Port is best left for at least 10 years before drinking. Good VP should be left for 20, 30, 40, 50 years or more before it reaches it's peak. If you buy and drink these 2003's now it will not give you a good idea of what this wine is meant to be.

Derek

Thanks Derek for your reply and advice.

I do agree with you that I should try to hunt down some older vintages of Port. I have already started, with a 1977 Gold Campbell. However, this is a Mag, and I'm still waiting for a moment where I can serve this big bottle.

I have a few problems in tracking down old ports. In Norway and our wine monopoly we don't have that much access to older vintages. And those who are available are often priced quite high. But - I'm trying.. I've heard there should be a 1983 available, not sure which producer, though..

However - as I'm building up a cellar, I'm also interested in having some Ports in there, to mature with me, so to speak..
This is the reason for my question, and - because I'm living in Norway, and NOW is when the 2003's are coming out for sale - I'm anxious to hear your recommendations.

Oyvind,

I would also like to welcome you to the forum. I hope you post as many questions as you have. If people know, then you should get an answer.

In general, I enjoy my vintage ports most when they are at least 10 years old. The oldest vintage port I have drunk is from 1963 so I can only read about older wines, but I am convinced that well made VP from a top vintage and a top shipper will last many decades.

2003 appears to be one of those vintages but it is very early to say how good a vintage it will prove to be. 1985 was thought to have been a great vintage at the time and showed much promise but wines from this vintage are unreliable. Wines from 1963 were thought to be superb, but now seem to be at their peak or fading. Who knows where 2003 will end up - but your choice of shippers is very good. Niepoort, Taylor and Fonseca are certainly making very good wines at present and I have no reason to expect their wines in 2003 to disappoint. Have you read Roy's 2003 tasting notes (there is a link to his tasting notes on the home page of the site)?

But having said my piece on the 2003 vintage, I do echo Derek's comments. If you really are new to VP then you will have to be prepared to put your 2003 vintage wines in a cool, dark place for at least another 7 years if you want to see the potential that they can offer. If you do decide to buy them then I would suggest that you also look to buy some wines from the early to mid 90's (or earlier) to drink while you wait for the 2003's to develop.

But, of course, there are always exceptions to the rule. There are some 2003 VP's which are very pleasant to drink at the moment...I'm just not sure that drinking Taylor, Fonseca or Niepoort too soon would let them show you their best.

Alex

Oyvind,

If you really want to buy 2003's then, as Alex has suggested, you should read Roy's tasting notes on this website as he seems to have tasted almost wine from every shipper that declared a vintage that year.

From memory, I think Roy recommended Fonseca, Niepoort, Vesuvio and Croft.

I will leave others to advise on 1983's as I have not had many. The only 83 I have in my cellar is Smith Woodhouse which is good drinking now but I think probably not much future ahead of it as it is already starting to lose some colour and depth.

Derek

Thanks Alex and Derek!

Finally I found the TN's from Roy, and I'm looking av the Vesuvio. It seems available in Norway, and might be a good choice for the 2003.

I'll definately try to get me some older VP's, to have some nice Ports in the years to come. When I find some of these, I'll check Roy's notes on the specific vintages.

Thanks again for the help!

Oyvind

Graham's has a nice '83...I also have an '83 SW Derek - thanks for the note on it, I'll have to open it one of these days!

My advice to you Oyvind, would be to grab some 2000 LBV's from those producers and find one that you prefer over the rest, then consult Roy's notes to see if the 2003 from your chosen producer lives up to expectations (which all appear to have done).

While an LBV is a little different from a VP, the general character of the producer will show through, and if you like the general character of one over another, that's the one I'd go buy the case of. Not to mention an LBV is usually about 1/4 or less the cost of a VP... If you get discounts for mixed cases, then why not mix and match with two '03's from each?

I haven't bought much in the way of '03 myself yet as I've been trying to educate myself through purchase of older vintages from the 70's, 80's and 90's, and trying out various tawnies. The LBV's from the late 90's and 2000 are an affordable way to enjoy something younger. With the prices of the 2000 and 2003 vintages reaching rediculous heights in my area, I've been happy to focus on older ports (I still can't figure that one out...older is cheaper?). Now that I find myself more educated and with a nice stockpile of older stuff, I'm noticing that the 2000 vintage prices are coming down fairly dramatically (scored a case of Vesuvio (6) for under $300 today!), so my focus will likely eke toward the 2000's and 2003's.

I'm almost hoping there's a split in 2004 which may help bring down some of the prices for '03 to something more reasonable. Interesting note...the first bottle of port I ever bought was an '03 Fonseca as a keepsake for my 2 year-old niece. I took a class shortly thereafter to see what it was all about and that was the beginning of the end of my disposable cash.

Mike.

Hi Oyvind,

Welcome to FOR THE LOVE OF PORT. I am happy to have another Port lover from Norway here and hope you will enjoy your time spent finding your away around the rest of the website and of course, here in the FORUM!

Here is the link to the 2003 Port article that was mentioned above:
http://www.fortheloveofport.com/article ... recast.htm


When you do have more time to explore the website, you can do so by saving this URL: http://www.fortheloveofport.com to your "favorite places."

Although I turn 49 this year, I still did purchase some of my favorites from the 2003 vintage. The best known Port critic in the world, James Suckling gave an overall 98 or 99 pt. rating for the 2003 vintage.

You can read my tasting notes in the article above and certainly from various other sources. I have had most of these wines now a half a dozen times, with consistent notes and will stick by my impressions for years to come. I have been judging cask samples of Port since the vintages of the early 1990s and it is no easy task. Unlike the advice given by some of the gents above, I do think it is wise to purchase some 2003s, whether you are old or young. These same naysayers loved the 2003s when they were offered to them blind by my biz partner, while we were all together in London two months ago.

It is a matter of taste whether you like to drink your Vintage Ports young or old and the older I get, the less I feel that I must wait 30+ years to enjoy my VPs. I was a staunch purist for waiting and wound up with a nice mature cellar for that very reason. But now I am tending to drink the wines while young, far more often than ever before. If nothing else, you get to see what the future holds in store for particluar bottlings.

Whatever you do decide on, you'll be happy in the future knowing that you have purchased these on release and have perfect provenance with your Ports!

Again, welcome aboard and please feel free to ask any qyestions you may have. Check out the "Basics Forum" for some frequently asked and excellent questions from beginners and experts alike!

Wow - I'm overwhelmed with the response here, and the well thought of answers you all bring.

I've already been exploring the webpage, and it's of course in my favorites..

I'll definately buy 2003, and some older VP's as well. I didn't think of trying a "horizontal" tasting of LBV to explore the differences among the producers. Seems like a great idea.

Thanks to you all so far, and looking forward to more posts on this and other topics.

Oyvind

Roy,

I am surprised to see you advising a port novice to pay good money for bottles that need to be properly stored for 10 years + before they are ready to give anywhere near their best. It is unlikely that someone with no experience of port would have the knowledge or means to store it properly.

I'm happy to hold my hand up as one of those who joyfully glugged down a few glasses of Portal 03 kindly supplied by Mario last November. However, I don't see how this relates to the rights and wrongs of buying 03's v 85's as an ideal introduction to port. I enjoyed the experience in the context of a tasting but the main outcome of it was that I confirmed to myself that young port is not for me.

Derek

Roy - you're absolutely right. When Mario kindly gave us the opportunity to taste the Sandeman, Portal and Portal+ wines from the 2003 vintage, this was the first time I had ever tried VP so young .... and I was really impressed.

What I found was that since I had absolutely no experience in tasting wines this young and having been able to follow them over time, I was only able to judge each wine on how I enjoyed it at that time.

I thought the Sandeman '03 was superb - full of fruit and with such ripe tannins that it was a joy to drink there and then. I am still looking to buy a case of it for current drinking when the '03s arrive in the UK in numbers.

I have also bought and tried the Vesuvio '03 and this is where my inexperience in tasting such young wines shows through. I was disappointed by the Vesuvio '03 and didn't enjoy it as much as I had expected to given all the good things that you and others fortunate enough to have tasted most of the '03s have written about this wine. However, I fully understand and expect that it will taste much better in a few years time. You are probably able to compare and contrast the '03 with the '94 as they both were 2 years after each vintage. I don't have that experience yet.

Without that experience, all I can do is to say that I though the '94 Vesuvio was a better wine when I drank it in November last year than the '03 was when I drank that in December last year. Was this difference due to bottle ageing or due to the innate quality of the two wines? I don't know and don't have the experience to be able to answer that question.

But I have bought several cases of the '03 wines and will hold on to those for a few years before I open them. In the meantime, the youngest wines that I open will likely be the '97s. My recent experience with one of these was very rewarding and will mean that I will try some of my other '97s during the coming year.

If I was suggesting to someone which 12 bottles to buy as their first purchase of Vintage Port (but I think Mike's suggestion of an LBV tasting first is an excellent one), then I would suggest a range of vintages rather than just to go for the 2003 wines. Perhaps 3-4 bottles from 2003, some single quinta wines from good "undeclared" vintages such as 1988, 1995 and 1996 for current drinking and 1 or 2 trophy wines from birth years or anniversary years.

Alex