And the winer is ...

Al B. · Post by **Al B.** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 1:05 am

Ricardo,

The Grahams '85 is a lovely port and I hope you enjoy it. But I still recommend the Vesuvio '94 :)

I've had the Warre '77 and posted a tasting note on the forum. You should find it if you do a search for "TN Warre 1977". It was enjoyable, but enjoyable only has one "o" and Steven's recommendation for the Dow had 8 "o"s, so I would go with his advice.

Alex

Dave Johnson · Post by **Dave Johnson** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 12:20 pm

i could be very happy with a cellar full of 85 Grahams and 77 Dow

Ricardo · Post by **Ricardo** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:30 pm

bridgema wrote:Ricardo,

The Grahams '85 is a lovely port and I hope you enjoy it. But I still recommend the Vesuvio '94 :)

Alex

I’m learning fast. 1994 was an extraordinary year and is still at a good price (if you can speak of a nice price in terms of Portugal, a nation were the minimum salary is about 370€/month ?!?!?!), which means that I will buy some 94 bottles, from dow’s, vesuvio’s and graham’s (two of each would be nice ... but one of the first two is more likely).

Last week I was speaking with my favourite wine seller about Port wine, and we says :- Why do you think that Port is not a very popular drink in our country ? Because is expensive, he concluded.

Returning to 1977, the Portuguese forum seller proposed a (very?) good price for the dow’s and graham’s. The wines were conserved in the house best place, away from light and in a correct position, without great temperature variations, but without humidity and temperature’s control.

He seems to be a fair person, I asked him about the corks, speaking about several bad experiences read in net forums, and he answer that only opened two bottles, one with some cork problems which didn’t affect the wine (tasted the same, as long I can remember He said).

I was thinking in buying Dow’s and Graham, or you advice to go for Dow alone

?

Ricardo · Post by **Ricardo** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:35 pm

RonnieRoots wrote:I've noticed that VP is very expensive in Portugal and prices for older vintages are often insane.
That said, Garrafeira Nacional had soom good prices on Warre's vintages. The '94 is € 45,-, and while still young, it is already very easy to appreciate.

Didn´t forget Ronnie's advice, 94 is inded a wise choice, with several good choices.

Marc J. · Post by **Marc J.** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 9:34 pm

Ricardo,

Athough not classic wines, both the Dow's '77 as well as the Graham's '77 are well made, powerful ports. You might want to consider buying a bottle of each and holding a small port tasting. These two shippers styles are on opposite ends of the spectrum so it might make for an interesting evening. I must admit that although there has been some controversy concerning Grahm's '77, I've found it to be a VERY tasty port!

Marc

Post by **Roy Hersh** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 2:32 am

I have had MANY bottles of '77 Graham's and it is really the only Graham's I can think of that I am not a sucker for. I will be having it again on Sunday. Even blind and baving been told that it was the '70, I could pick it out as the '77. The alcohol has never integrated in this wine and only can be tolerated with enormous amounts of time in an open decanter. This is my experience and I know many folks that really enjoy it.

Last week I was speaking with my favourite wine seller about Port wine, and we says :- Why do you think that Port is not a very popular drink in our country ? Because is expensive, he concluded.

Actually, Portugal is one of the top consumers of Port in the world. But with only 10 million people in Portugal, it is not going to be able to compete with countries that have populations in multiples of your country. I don't think it is the price that is the issue, as I have seen very reasonable prices for entry level Ports. The Vintage Ports are expensive there, sadly. Colheitas and Tawnies by Portuguese rather than British producers are priced to sell to the local citizens and there are certainly particular producers that market to the domestic market and are very successful. Ferreira, Quinta do Crasto and Offley come to mind.

Ricardo · Post by **Ricardo** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 8:05 am

Roy Hersh wrote:The Vintage Ports are expensive there, sadly.

I’ am sorry, we were speaking about vintage, and the statement about the Port being expensive ‘maybe’ was applied to PV.

This wine seller is located in a central area, and is usually visited by tourists. Considering the fact that he, in comparison, must sell more Port to those than to the Portuguese, maybe justify that phrase.