Port 101

[Roy Hersh]

Hopefully, this will take some of the starch out of us Port geeks and remind us of our humble roots and vines. Please DO feel free to ask ANYTHING you ever wanted to know about Port but were afraid to ask. WE are here to provide you the answers to things like what is the difference between a ruby and a tawny Port. How long do I decant .... Port (or Madeira)? What kind of glasses do you serve it in? At what temperature? Anything goes and I hope this will be a very comfortable and unintimidating place for those that are looking to learn the basics, on their way to furthering their explorations.

Don't forget, we all started in the very same place!

[Doug Zdanivsky]

Hi!

I've never tried Port, but have been reccomended some good producers and vintages (Warre's '77), and am eager to try some and see if I like it..

Questions:

Do all 20+ year old Ports have to be decanted? For how long, generally?

How important is stemware?

I was considering getting a Riedel sommelier series Port glass, and using it for Ports, AND all my red wine..

Would this be practical? The Port glass looks the same as the Bordeaux glass, basically..

Does anyone know of any good retailers for Port in Vancouver, BC?

[Roy Hersh]

Do all 20+ year old Ports have to be decanted? For how long, generally?
Doug, you came all the way over here from the WS site ... thanks! I hope you find the Port threads here as interesting as that long one going on there!
When you say 20+ year old Ports, I assume you are not talking about Tawny and are refering to Vintage Ports. Although no one will punish you for not decanting a VP with 20 or more years of bottle age, you certainly will be rewarded for doing so. There is no rule for the time needed to decant the wines, as there are far more exceptions to the "rule" and guidelines are very broad. I am happy to help ANYONE who is looking for specific VP decanting time information. I used to have 30-50 emails on this topic per week. Actually, it was one of the reasons I thought having an interactive Forum would be fun. This way, decanting suggestions could be discussed, other Port lovers could add their differing opinions ... and we could all learn together. I hope that in the future, should you have ANY VP decanting (or other question) you will feel comfortable coming here to ask!

How important is stemware? The answer is here: http://www.fortheloveofport.com/forum/v ... c.php?t=78

I was considering getting a Riedel sommelier series Port glass, and using it for Ports, AND all my red wine..
Doug,
I would suggest that you avoid this strategy. IMHO, the Sommelier glass adds little to the party and is considerably more expensive than the same producer's Vinum Port glass. More importantly, the aforementioned glass would not provide you with the optimum drinking pleasure when tasting say, a Burgundy. The same could be said for Bordeaux, Zin, Barolo, Riesling or a Chateauneuf du Pape. These require larger bowls that will emphasize their particular aromatic and flavor profiles. These characteristics will not be highlighted by using a small and narrow bowl of a Port glass.

Would this be practical? The Port glass looks the same as the Bordeaux glass, basically..
Again, I think you are looking at a picture on a website or in a catalogue. But Port glasses are typically about 5-7 ounces in total and Bordeaux glasses are MUCH larger in size.

Does anyone know of any good retailers for Port in Vancouver, BC?
I am not at my desk but have two friends who run a small chain of wine shops up there, that do a very good job with Port wine. I will add the specifics later.

[Doug Zdanivsky]

Thanks for the welcome and the prompt reply!..

God knows wether I'll like Port, but I believe in making sure I do everything to ensure it makes the BEST 1st impression..

I assume you are not talking about Tawny and are refering to Vintage Ports

Correct.. I gleaned a good deal from the WS thread.. :)

What I wondered, though, was what I should look for in order to deem wether it had been decanted "enough"..

Does the odour change, decrease/increase in intensity? etc..

Is there a rule of thumb?

I read in a WS article (July 31, 2005) that the conventional wisdom of setting the bottle upright before decanting is in fact counter-intuitive..

IE. the whole point is not to disturb the sediment so that it doesn't saturate the rest of the wine with super fine particles and "taint" the rest of the wine.

Sounds reasonable to me.. What do you think of this?

Thanks for the link regarding stemware.. I'll get dedicated glasses for both Reds, and Ports.. Well, a glass each.. I'm not rich.. :)

I have a set of the Vinum series Bordeauxs.. But I'll get 1 "good" one, too.. A Sommelier, I think..

But wait, you say they aren't worth the expense?

And thank you in advance if you could get me any leads on good Port retailers in the Vancouver area..

There was a limited selection of Port on the BC Liquor store website, but no Warre's 1977, which I would like to try and obtain..

http://www.bcliquorstores.com/en/produc ... asc=1&pg=1

How would a 20 year Taylor Tawny would compare to the Warre's?

[Doug Zdanivsky]

Ah, read your FAQ on how long to decant, Roy, so..

Please disregard that portion of my follow-up post, thanks..

[Roy Hersh]

What I wondered, though, was what I should look for in order to deem wether it had been decanted "enough"..

This is a complex and "slippery-slope" of a question. I will tread carefully and hope to answer this to your satisfaction. The simple answer is: BALANCE. But I don't think you'll be satisfied with a one word response. So:
a. the color should improve in terms of going from lighter to darker (depending on the vintage/producer) but you will notice some evolution.
b. the body will gain more weight and this does not happen quickly.
c. one of the key ingredients to satisfy your qualifier of enough is: the integration of the spiritous alcohol. MANY VPs have aromatics of alcohol and this is especially true with a few producers and more so, with young Vintages. The lack thereof (of alc.) in a young VP is a very good sign of balance. Extended decanting can help the alcohol blow off on the nose, and the "heat" on the aftertaste will dissipate and integrate with time in decanter. You will definitely notice this!
d. the TANNIN that is a key structural component in all Ports and most noticeably in young Vintage Ports, can be tamed by extended decanting. You will notice "enough" when the big grip or ripe tannins (astringent palate presence) that you feel in your mouth ... have been softened. Some Port purists point to this dynamic and say that extended decanting, artificially softens a VP or is the bastardized attempt to quckly make ready to drink a wine that is too young.

There may be other facets that are not being adequately addressed here, but this should be ENOUGH for now.

[Roy Hersh]

Does the odour change, decrease/increase in intensity? etc.. Is there a rule of thumb?

Yes the aromatic profile will usually evolve with extended decanting time. Not only evolve, but improve and become more pronounced and easier to discern (esp. for the more advanced taster of wine). I am not aware of any rule of thumb for this specific dynamic.

I read in a WS article (July 31, 2005) that the conventional wisdom of setting the bottle upright before decanting is in fact counter-intuitive..

I can only assume that this was the work of James Suckling, resident WS Port expert. Since I have not seen this article, I can not comment. But given the premise in the example you mentioned here is my quick thought on the topic: I don't see sediment as tainting the wine and although it doesn't feel good, it doesn't "taste" bad ... IMHO. Obviously you don't want to swallow sediment, if it can be avoided. But the "superfine particles" really have little effect. That said, I avoid chunks.

I have a set of the Vinum series Bordeauxs.. But I'll get 1 "good" one, too.. A Sommelier, I think..
But wait, you say they aren't worth the expense?

Actually, that is not what I said at all. I was ONLY refering to the Riedel Port glass in terms of the Sommelier Series andNOT Bordeaux or other types of glasses. Go back to my post on the Port glasses and I have added information that you might find quite useful.


Last but not least, I can recommend this one Vancouver retailer of Ports:

Liberty Merchant Company - they have multiple locations and I know the GM of the chain, quite well. I can not speak to their prices, but I can assure you they do have quite a large selection.

I hope I have answered all of your questions. Sorry for the delayed response, as I am working a project out of town.

[Doug Zdanivsky]

I can only assume that this was the work of James Suckling, resident WS Port expert.

Sorry, I should have provided the name.

It was in fact a Mr. Bob Dickinson, and the article pertained to all wine, not Ports specifically (p. 109 of the afore-mentioned issue)..

That said, I avoid chunks. Shocked

:)

I visited Liberty Wine Merchants! I didn't think to check out their Port selection.. From their website I see they have the following Ports:

* Broadbent Ports & Madeiras
* Falua ALENTEJO
* J.P. Ramos ALENTEJO
* Quarles Harris OPORTO
* Smith Woodhouse OPORTO


I'll have to see if they also stock, or can get, Warre's..

But of those Port houses Smith Woodhouse would be the better of these?

Thanks for the great decanting notes!!