For The Love Of Port

Hello All,

was on a trip a few weeks ago in Chicago and tried the 1908 D'Oliveira Bual Madeira at the Intercontinental Hotel. My brother and I thought it would be interesting to try such an old drink. I have become an addict.

Since then I have purchased several bottles between 1834 and 1908 from the Rare Wine Co, but have only opened the 1853 King Pedro V Port so far. I thought it was very good, and am surprised at how it has changed the last 1.5 weeks.

Are older ports more rare than madeira? The Rare Wine Co has many old madeiras for sale, but only the King Pedro V for vintage port.

Regards,
Jason

Jason,

Welcome to FTLOP forum, and glad you found us. I guess I should also welcome you to our crazy adiction, Port and Madeira. Now that the bug has bitten you, prepare yourself for the friendliest wine forum there is. On to your question..

Are older ports more rare than madeira?

In general yes, very old Ports (Pre 1930's) are a lot harder to find than Madeira. Old ports also tend to be much more expensive than Madeira. Don't get me wrong, they can be found, but provence (its history) can be a problem with old Ports, whereas Madeira is much more durable and able to survive in conditions that would ruin Port or wine.

BTW, that King Pedro is actually a Niepoort Colheita (just the background on who produced it since the label does not tell you that)

My understanding is that the King Pedro is really a VP, but must be called a Colheita because, at some point in the distant past, the holder of the wine was required to declare his VP's for tax purposes. In order to avoid the taxes, this lot wasn't disclosed as such. So, it must now be considered a Colheita.

Or, I could be completely wrong about that. . .

Trip Johnson
Atlanta, Georgia

check out this post

http://www.fortheloveofport.com/ftlopfo ... king+pedro

Apparently it was found in cask (thus it would be a Colheita). For a VP, it would have to have been bottled between the second and third year after harvest (1855-1856). I believe the King Pedro was bottled in 2001 or 2002, IIRC.

Wow! That was my port tasting at my father's house. I forgot we had that one in the line up. I've had it a couple of times. You are correct that it was very late bottled, and I think this accounts for its freshness.

So, not a VP. Still, there's a tax story in there somewhere. . . I just can't remember what it is. I'll have to ask around. Cheers.

OK, I went back to the well (my friend Bob Fleming) and got the tax story straight about the King Pedro V. Here it is:

It has to do with why it's not a Colheita - even though it otherwise would qualify. [It could never be a Vintage Port, too much time in wood.]

Why no "Colheita" designation or vintage date (1853) on the label? The answer suggests that the national sport of Portugal is the same as that of France: hide from the tax man.

When the Port Council (or whatever the name of the regulating body is) was created (1971?), all producers were supposed to register their existing stocks. Many did not, most likely out of fear that the tax man might cometh. As a result, the non-registered stocks of wine do not now qualify for official designations (i.e., Vintage, Vintage Character, Colheita, etc.) even though they otherwise satisfy all the requirements. So, the King Pedro is a Colheita in everything but name.

Good story about the tax,
and Hi Jason, was the 1908 just available via the Hotel Bar/restaurant, or is there a story how you came across this drink whilst in the Hotel?
Alan

Hi,

Not much of a story unfortunately. There is a corner business, don't remember the name, which is connected to the hotel. They only serve wine, cheese, and chocolate.

They had a variety of wine flights, and my brother and I each had a burgundy flight, and their blue cheese plate was excellent. They also had a madeira flight called "Decadence" which intrigued us, so we tried it. It was made up of 3 madeiras, 1968, 1929, and the 1908.

Regards,
Jason

Ahh the tax man...glad to see everyone avoids him