The Great Terrantez Tasting -- time/place TBD

[Shawn Denkler]

As was stated before, the planning on this started over a year ago. People, including myself, committed to it early and I cleared out my schedule to be sure to make it. I understand some individuals wished to be added on much later. What do you do, kick out the early ones who committed a year ago? As Peter stated, "Join the Conversation." I believe that everyone who committed a year ago did make it.

I committed over a year ago, within two weeks of this thread starting, but the thread went dark as Roy stated and it was obvious that I was not one of the chosen ones. I have a deep Madeira cellar and an exceptionally deep port cellar and many decades of knowledge as a winelover and professional winemaker. I met Roy at a Quinta do Noval Nacional tasting (which was not the first time I tried the 31 Nacional). I've attended many Madeira tastings including one Roy hosted. So who knows what the selection criteria were to attend the tasting.

[Shawn Denkler]

Roy mentioned he invited "one high visibility wine journalist attending for posterity sake". Could somebody who attended please let me know who that what so I can read his or her notes on this historic tasting when they are written.

[Steve Pollack]

Roy mentioned he invited "one high visibility wine journalist attending for posterity sake". Could somebody who attended please let me know who that what so I can read his or her notes on this historic tasting when they are written.

Shawn, Neal Martin attended the event.

[Steve Pollack]

As was stated before, the planning on this started over a year ago. People, including myself, committed to it early and I cleared out my schedule to be sure to make it. I understand some individuals wished to be added on much later. What do you do, kick out the early ones who committed a year ago? As Peter stated, "Join the Conversation." I believe that everyone who committed a year ago did make it.

I committed over a year ago, within two weeks of this thread starting, but the thread went dark as Roy stated and it was obvious that I was not one of the chosen ones. I have a deep Madeira cellar and an exceptionally deep port cellar and many decades of knowledge as a winelover and professional winemaker. I met Roy at a Quinta do Noval Nacional tasting (which was not the first time I tried the 31 Nacional). I've attended many Madeira tastings including one Roy hosted. So who knows what the selection criteria were to attend the tasting.

Shawn, you did indeed "commit" very early on, but also mentioned that you had no Terrantez. At that point, the exact nature of the event was still evolving. You probably assumed, reasonably so, that it would not be too difficult to acquire a bottle. At that time, I had also assumed that my 1905 Blandy's T would be suitable as well. Roy posted a note 3 days after your commitment, and essentially explained that this would be epic and historic in scope. And Roy also offered at that time advice to those seriously interested. I have copied Roy's post from 2/10/11 below:

"IF you really do want to participate in the Terrantez event, then please spend the next year saving and hunting down a bottle that is worthy. If you are not sure and need advice, please feel free to email me and I will let you know if a specfic bottle you are looking to purchase would be fitting and proper for the aforementioned Terrantez theme. That said, I am not here to advise you on WHERE to find such a bottle, I expect you to do that on your own. Eric has posted a few examples of what types of bottles are currently being offered and you could certainly continue to look elsewhere and at many other auctions where Terrantez would appear. But I repeat, BEFORE spending money on an expensive bottle, you might want to run it by me by email so you don't purchase an expensive bottle that won't fit this singular very special theme.

Sorry if this gets some FTLOP'ers aggravated, but I'd rather have this out in the open now and not have people angry or disappointed later. I have also discussed this with one other person here who's opinion I greatly respect and they felt the exact same way and encouraged me to be this direct. "

I am not sure if you were in direct contact with Roy after that post, but I was, especially after realizing that the Terrantez that I possessed would not be worthy of such an historic tasting. I told Roy that I was very serious about still attending and would be willing to purchase a worthy and expensive bottle should one become available. He told me that he was hopeful that a worthy bottle would become available. I ultimately was lucky enough to be able to adopt (purchase) a suitable bottle.

I think Roy did everything possible to make sure the attendees were chosen as fairly as possible. I bet this was not an easy task. I don't think that you or anyone else was intentionally excluded, but perhaps you and others did not follow up enough to be included. No disrespect intended at all, Shawn, but it seems to me that the selection criteria was laid out very clearly by Roy on 2/10/11.

[Shawn Denkler]

Steve thank you for letting me know Neal Martin was the wine writer in attendance.

I was aware of the selection criteria posted by Roy on 2/11/11. My Madeira cellar goes back to 1827 Quinta de Serrado, but is short on Terrantez as I mentioned. So I was looking forward to a Madeira tasting at the highest level. I am no stranger to rare wine and own probably the three finest ports of all time which I will be using for a tasting possibly latter this year. I suspect my 1851 Stibbart’s is the last bottle left in the world. From a previous “Great Port Tasting” I hosted I would agree with Michael Broadbent that it is “The most magnificent old port I have ever drunk.”

I set the record at Butterfield & Butterfield in 1996 for the most expensive bottle of wine ever sold by them. I latter opened this bottle at a tasting, just one of many which I have charged a thousand dollars or more for people to attend at my cost. I am well aware of the hard work necessary to organize tastings of high quality like this recent tasting.

I imported and sold very rare wines and port for many years. I still have contacts in England for importing wine but it took a while for me to find Madeira of the calibre necessary for the tasting. By the time I found some exceptional Terrantez it was obvious that I was out of the loop for this tasting. I was deeply disappointed to hear Roy say he had places available till late January since I had never heard from him.

Well this tasting has gone down in history and I’m looking forward to seeing the notes. But there is no reason not to do a similar tasting. With older wines bottle variation is such a big factor it is fun to have the same wines again. Why don’t we just do a “Greatest Madeira Tasting” before they all disappear. We are lucky to be drinking any Madeira over 100 years old as they are getting so rare every year.

[Steve Pollack]

But there is no reason not to do a similar tasting. With older wines bottle variation is such a big factor it is fun to have the same wines again. Why don’t we just do a “Greatest Madeira Tasting” before they all disappear. We are lucky to be drinking any Madeira over 100 years old as they are getting so rare every year.

Shawn, I agree and when the next event occurs, I look forward to both attending and drinking great old Madeiras with you in person.

[Roy Hersh]

Shawn D. wrote:

So who knows what the selection criteria were to attend the tasting.

Hi Shawn,

I think I've done my best to be transparent and let people know how the guests were selected. As Steve pointed out, yes, you had mentioned you would like to attend, but also stated that you had no worthy Terrantez to offer. I was clear about getting in touch with me for those that were interested in attending and that I'd go out of my way to help. That's how Steve and a few others wound up with bottles. I worked hard to unearth bottles that were offered to a few guests at below market prices, so that they could participate. I felt I had gone above and beyond the call of duty to enable people to come to this event who were willing to make the effort.

However, you failed to ever get in touch with me at all. So while I am willing to let you vent your unhappiness at not being a participant, you must take some personal responsibility for the outcome, as it was in your power to be included had you taken the time to reach out like several others did who were then included.

[Alan Gardner]

Having been away for a couple of days, I now see this has become the hottest topic on the Board.

GREAT news for Madeira.

I'm looking forward to the next one - wherever it is.

BUT I don't think it's fair to expect Roy to organize it (if he wants to do so, I'm only too happy to let him).

So who is willing to step up?

On another thread, discussing vintage vs. solera madeiras, I offered up a selection from my cellar - but nobody took up the challenge to organize.

I do my bit locally, but given the logistics (and legalities) of operating in Ontario, don't anticipate that such a 'Grand' tasting can realistically be achieved here. Having my own group of 16, I also can't see how I would exclude them (and wouldn't want to). But if anybody wants to take a chance on a cancellation for our regular late November dinner, I'd be happy to have the place go to an enthusiast, rather than drumming up a 'newbie'. And one person has already taken me up on that.

Let's have some "participaction".

[Eric Ifune]

Shawn Denkler wrote:
But there is no reason not to do a similar tasting. With older wines bottle variation is such a big factor it is fun to have the same wines again. Why don’t we just do a “Greatest Madeira Tasting” before they all disappear. We are lucky to be drinking any Madeira over 100 years old as they are getting so rare every year.

Shawn, I agree and when the next event occurs, I look forward to both attending and drinking great old Madeiras with you in person.

I agree also. I've a few more old Terrantez which I could share!

[Roy Hersh]

The article and photos are in the newsletter that will be in your mailbox by the time you wake up in the a.m. Feedback always appreciated, whether you were fortunate enough to attend or not.

[Peter Reutter]

Thanks Roy,

reading this report and the TNs and seeing the pictures brings back so many pleasant memories, it was a wonderful experience! I will treasure this event for the rest of my madeira wine-life.

And may be, if anyone has to much time on his hands, he/she could do another epic tasting, since some grape varieties are still available. Just think of "Mighty Malmseys", "Blockbuster Boals", "Vanishing Verdelhos" and "Superstitious Sercials". However I am not sure if there are enough wines around for the "Breathtaking Bastardos"-Tasting...

[Tom Murnan]

This is the first time I have gotten on the forum, or submitted a post. I knew there was a reason for subscribing to FTLOP, and the Great Terrantez Tasting article was a great example. I would have to say, that was the most interesting article on Madeira I have read in a long time. Of course, I was green with envy, what with the fabulous wine lineup, and some of the most dedicated Madeira lovers around. I have met Eric Ifune at a Rare Wine event, the Leacock Tasting, in San Francisco. I wouldn't be surprised if Eric doesn't remember me, though. If memory serves, he was just returning from one of Roy's trips to Madeira. I am glad to say, I am going on the Fortification Tour this year, and am counting the days till June 3rd. I have known Mannie Berk for a number of years, and Andrew Jones came to our local International Wine & Food 40th anniversary last summer. Mannie has been singing the praises of Neal Martin in his blog. And, of course, I have met Roy Hersh. I would have loved to met the other invitees.

When I spied the 1802 Acciaioly on the list, I knew this was something incredibly special to taste, and Roy's tasting notes bore that out: 99/100. What kept it from being 100, Roy? You didn't say. I guess my life has "been worth living" (as Roy's notes say) since I had this wine at a 50th birthday party I threw for myself in 2001. It was stunningly fabulous, without a doubt the best wine I have ever tasted in my all too short wine tasting career. One always regrets mistakes in buying decisions, and I am now wishing that I had gotten another bottle back when it was relatively cheap and most importantly, avaialble.

When I started reading the article, I was asking myself how one got invited to this rarified club of Madeira aficianatos. Then I read in the first paragraph that participants were chosen from the FTLOP forum. Reading the forum, it reinforced how selective the selection process was.

I am hoping there will be a repeat of this event, Son of TTTT, or TTTT 2, or some such name. I have a bottle of 1795 Barbeito Terrantez that should be consumed only by those who love and appreciate fine and rare Madeira. I guess that means I will have to start reading the forum and watching for another stellar event.

Tom Murnan

[Roy Hersh]

Tom,

Eric will be with us again in June and you will surely get to spend time with him and the other guests.

Glad you decided to join us here on the Forum. Do you appreciate Port as well?

I will DEFINITELY be planning another Madeira event, possibly for later this year and another for next year. But I will need to figure out a way to make this fair to people before saying any more. :)

Thank you for the kind words on the article, it is rare that there's any feedback beyond "buyer's opportunities" of what's topical good, bad or ugly ... in the newsletter.

[Tom Murnan]

I am more of a neophyte on Port than Madeira. Madeira is my first love (Hence the Fortification Tour rather than the other strictly Port tours), but I do totally love a good Port. I have several of Roy's list of must have Ports in my cellar...but no white Ports, like the '52 Dalvos. My little local Port Group would be amazed about a Great White Port, like the '52 that is pushing a perfect rating. There is so much to learn about Port that I don't know [but that I want to know]. Eric Infune was sitting next to me at the Leacock tasting so I am excited that I will know someone on the next Fortification Tour!

But Roy, you did not answer my question, and everyone is wondering: Why not a hundred points on the 1802. I just went back and looked at my notes from 2001: 100/100. This wine that changed my life and expecatations of what a hundred point wine is.

Forum participants: How many times have you been disappointed by a Parker or Wine Spectator or Tanzer annointed 100 point wine when they didn't deliver. To me, a 100 point wine must be a mind-bending, staggering, rocking, stunningly-fabulous wine. I bought a case of 100 point rated 1982 Chateau Mouton Rothschild as futures, but my bottles have not been 100 points in quality. I would sell them in a heartbeat at market prices to some unsuspecting Points and Label Hunter simply because they have not been mind-blowing, and I would earn a great profit over the futures price I paid in 1983. Then, I could afford an several 1802 AcciaiolyTerrantez! [If I could find them.] But the Acciaioly 1802 Terrantez was an earthshattering, mind-blowing, and unbelievable wine, not likely to be duplicated, something etched in your mind even after you get Alsheimers and can't remember anything. To me, a hundred point wine should be almost life-changing or at least mind-changing. You have a whole different conception of what a "perfect" wine is: Totally satisfying, without fault or flaw, deep, & complex, with layers and layers of complex flavors, and an everlasting farewell. You could concentrate on the bouquet alone for an hour, without even tasting the wine. That is what the 1802 was for me, and what it sounded like it was for the TTTT Group, despite a meager pour of about only 1.5 ounces to savor. I have never experienced another wine that meets that criteria [maybe I will on the 2012 Fortification Tour, if Roy so arranges it, hint, hint]. So I regret I did not buy more 1802. But I do have one 1795 Barbeito Terrantez to offer for a future tasting, but I am only willing to sacrifice it for a tasting similar to the TTTT. Part of the experience would be to enjoy it with connoisseurs and afficianatos who truly love and appreciate the history and the producer's effort that they are tating. That perfect, or nearly perfect, wine represents a lifetime of effort and achievement for those who produced it, a historic fact that we will be lucky to produce in our time, even with all our technology. In 2222 , will anyone be interested in a wine produced in 2012, and be willing to pay a premium for it?

So, I guess I am saying, reproduce the TTTT tasting, Call it TTTT-2 or whatever. Keep it at the same venue because they did such a great job with the food and service (which will make it much easier for the organizer). Make sure Mannie Berk and Roy Hersh are participants because of their vast knowledge. But this time, invite ME and I will bring the 1795 Barbeito Terrantez, which I hope will show a bit better than the 96 points awarded at the TTTT in March 2012. The 1795 Barbeito wine was a 99 points in the May 2011 FTLOP, the same as the 1802 in the TTTT of March 2012. Eric Infune can bring a new 1802 Acciaioly to TTTT-2 so we can compare and contrast against how it did against both my 2001 notes (100/100) on the 1802, and against my "new" 1795 Barbeito in the competition. Maybe this time Roy will even relent and give the 1802 a 100 points! Hopefully, my perfectly cellared version of the 1795 Barbeito Terrantez will garner at least 99 points, like the May 2011 tasting that Roy put in the newsletter. The challenge is ON! Start the new thread! Just make sure I am a participant!!! I am looking forward to a tasting of a lifetime, which I missed out in March 2012!

Tom Murnan

[Roy Hersh]

See what you get for not paying attention to the Forum until now, even though you were a subscriber.

Tom,

I am not going to attempt a redux of the TTTT. Many of the bottles that showed up, just won't be found again. For example, I really wanted the 1846 Blandy's to be part of this event because it is one of the greatest Terrantez ever produced. I have only had that wine once, it was Peter's and we had it together here in Seattle on the EXACT same date as the NYC tasting last month ... 5 years earlier.

I will organize other great Madeira tastings and have done quite a few over the years. I am not talking about the seminar type like I did in ATL a week before the NY gig, but something on a much grander scale. That said, I am not so sure that ANY Madeira event I am ever involved with and I have been to literally dozens in the past two decades, but nothing will likely surpass that one ... at least for me ... during the rest of my days on earth.

You wrote:

But Roy, you did not answer my question, and everyone is wondering: Why not a hundred points on the 1802.

I am sure you read the entire article and tasting note. If I never knew which wine was in which glass, I'd still pick the 1802 out of the crowd as the single best glass before me. That is without any question and this wine did NOT score what it did because I knew what was in the glass. As you can tell from the Barbeito 1795 (which I had in March 2011 and maybe you confused it with May, because I also had it in May 2010) I have no issues scoring a wine that does not show up to par or its reputation. Heck there was one bottle that I won't pick on which is normally GREAT and scored 90 or 91 this time because it was either slightly off or the decant was not as long as it could've been.

Now to answer your question. The 1802 Acciaioly in the four times I've now tried it (some in just a small pour like this .... others, sharing the whole bottle) is the singular best Madeira and one of the two or three greatest wines I've had. The other which always is in the 98/99/100 pt. range on my scale ... is the 1994 Quinta do Noval Nacional. IMHO, it will best the 1963 and there are probably guys like Al B. and several others here with great Port palates that probably think I am daft, making a statement like that. I never had the 1963 Nacional young. My first time was only in 1998, with Bob Maliner. Anyway, the 1802 we had a few weeks ago, was a terrific bottle. The wine rocked in every way and even though there were another handful in the 97-98 range which are scores I don't give out often ... or easily; the 1802 surpassed them all. But I can relive in my memory, two of the other three times I've had this wine and this particular example did not strike me in that same way as when I gave it 100 points. At that super high end of the scale, it is as much a personal sense of the wine (even if it is the very first time you have it ... my other 100 point wine was the ONLY time that I have had a 1978 Henschke HIll of Grace in a dueling vertical of Grange vs. Hill of Grace ... nearly a decade ago). Those 3x that I've scored wines 100 points in 30 years of wine consumption, is obviously not something that hapens often and it is typically a surreal hedonistic experience and ethereal character to the wine that wins me over in body and soul that elicits a perfect score. It is so rare, that I can't describe it any better than that. I am just not that accomplished in my writing ability.

[Eric Ifune]

Tom,
I do remember you from the Leacock tasting. And will spend a whole week with you in June!
I've never given a wine 100 points, but have given several 99. One was that 1802 Acciaioly. I'd never had it before although I do have a bottle at home. I also brought the 1795 Barbieto to the Terrantez tasting and have had it before. I gave it 99 before, but only a lesser score this past time. It was a different bottling however, with a different script on the stenciling.
Another 99 score was in Vila Nova de Gaia. I'm hoping to repeat that experience in June!
Eric

[Glenn E.]

But Roy, you did not answer my question, and everyone is wondering: Why not a hundred points on the 1802?

Not that Roy needs any help, but I think you answered your own question:

To me, a 100 point wine must be a mind-bending, staggering, rocking, stunningly-fabulous wine.

Any wine can have an off night, even if "off" for a potentially 100-point wine means merely 97-99 points.

I've only rated 1 wine 100 points, and for me it was that mind-bending, staggering, stunningly-fabulous experience that you mentioned. Nothing else has reached that sublime level. In fact I don't believe I've ever rated anything 99 points... though I've reached 98 a couple of times.

[Brian Salzberg]

I am new to the FTLOP Forum, and I regret deeply not knowing about the GTT. I've been to several of Mannie's Madeira tastings in NYC (and, at one, we opened a bottle of the 1802 Terrantez.)
The 1802 was, probably, the greatest wine I've ever tasted....and I recall that I could have bought a bottle for $ 900. ! Those were the days! I hope to find out about future Madeira tastings here...
my bottles are mostly Buals and Sercials....Please let me know.....! BrianSalzberg

[Tom Murnan]

Easter Greetings, Eric

You said:

Another 99 score was in Vila Nova de Gaia. I'm hoping to repeat that experience in June!
Eric

What year are you talking about?

Tom

[Eric Ifune]

Happy Easter!
As I said, I've never given a wine 100 points. The closest was at the Weise & Krohn lodge. I'm not sure we're going there in June, but they have a section that is gated and locked. They have some ancient Colheita still in cask. We got a small taste of the 1863. I literally had to go sit down on some steps to contemplate the wine. Every sniff and taste showed a new aspect. Still the best wine I've ever had.